The Catalyst Out Now!

Shadow, there has been a division among fans really dating back to Reanimation. I was very active on LP.com boards from about 2001-2003 and MANY fans didn't like the amount of hip hop on Reanimation. And as for Meteora, there was initial praise from fans about it. Until everyone realized how much of a HT clone it is with watered down lyrics to boot. So really your contention that MTM sparked a divide is incorrect. These lines were already being drawn about LP expanding their sound or keeping their initial one since about summer of 2002.

 

Pandora and Last.Fm made their marks in 2007, the year MTM release. I highly doubt those services affected sales. They started to evolve after that. Thanks to the era of the smart phone.

My argument does not focus on albums sales. If you were to compare things "statistically" while the numbers did drop, in terms of technology and how the era has grown, it'd be on par to their previous 2 albums if not a tiny bit less. I am too tired to go around and look up all the information as alot of factors are involved in terms of sales. From 2001 to 2007.

Irrelevant. Just because they are awesome studio wise does not equate LP to be awesome in shows. LP sucked compared to many acts at the time. This of course is due to experience. So please do not bring this into the argument.

I did not make any comparisons, I only stated #s. You assumed I made comparisons. Finally "value-added goodies", that's all marketing. Linkin Park has not evolved "musically" in any sense that i can think of on what's out in this whole entire world. Hell probably some J-rock band is doing better than them! Who knows! Have they evolved "themselves" in terms of sound? Yes. This does not mean the "image" they left has evolved. I came for linkin park! Not band A / B or / C.

 

I was active around that time, the line was more vivid around MTM. In Reanimation, the whole fan community was against it. Only a few made a difference. While you are correct that Reanimation was the catalyst of it, the line was only drawn after MTM. If the line was drawn after Reanimation, Meteora would've never existed, don't you think?

 

Here's that same search without your creative editing:

http://twitter.com/#search?q=New Linkin Park Song

Here's another search just so we can get this in context:

http://twitter.com/#search?q=Linkin Park Catalyst

 

I still see more negatives than positives, but this regardless is a good find and a great place to find statistics on what the world feels "LP" should be. Thank god for twitter, this is why is so popular .

 

Custom music niches existed before that, and services to help you find them existed sooner. Last.fm and Pandora are just recent iterations of the mechanization of word of mouth that happened early on online. As long as music has been easy to download this service has existed.

You made a very specific point of showing that they were going from diamond to 4x plat, to 2x plat. You showed a trend that is industry wide and tried to narrow it to Linkin Park.

However you want to cut it, they sell tickets to shows. Lots of them. This is how bands really make money. The album is just a marketing device to get people to shows.

Linkin Park is Linkin Park. The entire music industry has refused to evolve since the internet took over, this is the first "lost decade" of music that I can find and it's disappointing. I give mad props to Linkin Park for being willing to break traditional barriers with this sound.

 

Some elements definitely remind me of "Breaking the Habit", which if I remember right, was a divisive song when it first came out, only to become one of the band's most popular songs (especially with what they ended up doing to it in concerts).

Another thought that came into mind as I listened to the song was that "Minutes to Midnight" was a pretty diverse album, and that while the music itself may not be the same with "A Thousand Suns", it's pretty clear Linkin Park wants to showcase a variety of styles.

They're enjoying making music exactly how they want it to sound. No one else is controlling them - Rick Rubin is a guide, but he doesn't make the band do anything they don't want to do - and they have the capital and chops to make it happen however they want it to.

That's pretty cool. I like the song. It's not my favorite, but it's better than a huge chunk of current music, and I can't wait for the actual album.

 

I'm fine with that. I expect initial reactions to be negative, it's change.

 

I was saying that these lines started around Reanimation and have grown more pronounced with each release. Actually, I'd say that the arguments about MTM were only a bit more than Meteora. There were A LOT of arguments about Meteora being too much like HT, Don Gilmore ruining their lyrics by having them write songs 100 times, etc, while many others argued they loved Meteora. Really, this was inevitable for a young band debuting with such a stellar, high-selling album. You're not going to win if you stick to your initial sound or you branch out. So you basically either like it or don't.

Personally, I love the song. I was a big fan of Reanimation's beats and more unorthodox structures and this reminds me of that. I like that they're branching out but to each his own.

 

You guys really gotta give this 15-20 listens. It's actually one of those songs where you have to in order to truly comprehend what it's all about.

 

@Shadow - I think you are missing just one main factor. At this point in LP's career, they are making music that they genuinely want to make, and aren't going to their "Oh What Do The Fans Want" handbook to see what will please us, since it is IMPOSSIBLE to please everyone out there. They are also at the point in their career, where they don't have anything to bitch about as far as life goes. The majority of em have families and children and have matured much more as adults over the past ten years. Plus I would find it VERY hard to complain about life making the salary they make and will possibly continue to earn.

When I look at how they were in the past for Hybrid Theory and Meteora, provided I do highly enjoy these albums, I find the sound to be rather burnt out. Nu metal has been dead for quite a LONG time and its gotten to the point where the whining on each album has to stop.

Minutes to Midnight was a definite maturing album for them. Now don't get me wrong, there were a couple songs that kind of resembled them complaining about life (Given Up is most notable in this), but the majority of the album was more meaningful with tracks like Hands Held High, which pointed out the troubles in politics and war, and The Little Things Give You Away, which was primarily about the tragedy of Hurricane Katrina, as pointed out in the side notes of the album booklet when they finished the song after the band visited New Orleans to see the wreckage that Katrina left behind.

And now we have A Thousand Suns. Now, as we cannot base much off of this album yet, there is not much to be said about it, except for the main concept of the art that we have been given, along with the VERY different track names for the song. The one thing we can base anything off of the record is The Catalyst , since it was, in fact, released worldwide today. The track, to me anyways, definitely holds up on its own, while it sorta has an HT/MTM vibe to it, as Chester had described in his tweet a few months back. HT for the electronic feel, with MTM having more mature lyrics and actual meaning to the song besides "I hate my life and I'm going to scream about it so I can make my point".

And as you have already said that you dont want Linkin Park to change their sound, just like quite a few fans out there, you guys are kinda shit outta luck when it comes to that, since as I said earlier in my post, that at this point it isn't about what the fans are satisfied with, it is about what they are satisfied with, and if they are satisfied with what they are putting out, wouldn't even matter if it was Polkacore Rap, we would still have to deal with it, and either A. Continue to support the band or B. Stop following them altogether, or C. start complaining about LP not going back to their old sound, and end up getting banned from sites like this because of trollish behavior, like we saw before with people who's usernames I will NOT mention.

 

So if this is the case, what was the point in bringing it up in the first place?

Industry wide but it does not affect a band that their front man and DJ are technologically savvy. And at the time (based on your glorious point u made) should've NOT affected them if those things were placed there. Right? This is what you are saying.

Well I'll be damn that the shows probably did not sell as much as the CDs did compared to other bands. I really can't find how any normal human being would enjoy a show that sounds nothing like their album (Live In Texas is living proof that it wasn't even as close) now, Road To Revolution heavily shows what this band can do with experience .

Linkin Park is NOT Linkin Park atm. I don't know what the hell they are and if you like "this" good for u! And this is not a lost decade, music has found it's way to make it's money and evolve. While it might not be the right way (With RNB and Hip-hop music, combinding genres to make singles that are popping at the clubs and drives consumers to actually buy albums more) or the movie industry going the HD route to provoke consumers to buy their product instead of pirating (that will heavily get you in trouble).

And I do not give LP any props for breaking any barrier. I give them props for reinventing and breaking a barrier back in 2000, but they have done nothing amusing with their new sound that entails they've done "something new" that some other band hasn't done back in the 90s or mid 2000s. I am sorry but I do not agree. I will still wait till this album drops to give my final verdict. This "song" the only thing that's new is that the instrumental shows that they did not give a crap what people said and I love that! But the lyrics do not same.

 

Here's what I'm going to say. Agree or disagree, I don't care. Because you all wanna know what? It's called an opinion. Each person has their own and everyone needs to stop breathing down everyone else's back about it. I love this song. I think the album is going to be amazing. I don't care if LP goes back to their HT ways or a new direction, I support them because I think they are a fucking phenomenal band. They've stood out against many others for 10 years now. A fucking decade. Most bands fade away and disappear in a quarter of that time, but LP is still around, selling out concerts worldwide, making albums that always go platinum, and still being a group of down to earth guys. That's not why I love the song, by all means, but that's why I love the band as they are. They make the music THEY want to make, not what people think they SHOULD make. Don't like the song? FINE. Stop berating and arguing about it. Just accept it and move on.

Secondly, call me a fanboy, I don't care. I loved every album just as much as the last. I'm not saying I love everything they've done, but the good songs make up for it. A lot of people think Meteora sucks, I don't. Same with MtM. Don't care. I love them all. Judge me, I dare you.

 

No.

 

This.

 

I am sure you were around when Anarchy started the whole ruckus as to why Meteora and Linkin Park as whole "Sucked". I personally love the instrumental of this song for the same reasons you said, but I do not like the lyrics. They lack power, too repetive and seem like they just did it to fill the gaps of the awesomeness in the track.

Linkin Park is making music to please the media. I've haven't seen LP make music that genuinely want since Reanimation. And that's a fact, the proof is in the pudding. This isn't about pleasing me, or pleasing joe or kirby for that matter. It's about sticking to your sound and evolving it, not changing your sound in it's entirety that you annihilate your fan base and make a new one.

I do not want Nu Metal! I do not want what the average LP fan wants. I just want them to evolve what they "had". It is lacking, the twitter messages, the fans coming in here are prove of that. And the "numbers" I posted earlier, only provide like 10% to my argument.

MTM was them addressing the audience that Xodus112 was speaking about. Every little thing that was a problem was addressed in MTM, except for the fact we were robbed of Mike. We got one song with him, and the rest was a Chester fest, with "wannabe" solos (this is entirely my opinion you guys can kill me for this lol). I do agree with everything that you are saying about MTM, I am not "mad" at that album. I am not saying it sucks, I am not saying I hate it. All I am stating is that it was done for different purposes. I don't consider it "Linkin Park" because what've i heard in this album (as many have said) U2 could've done better. That's why they exist!

We aren't completely shit out of luck, Mike did say he was gonna rap and I am looking forward to that, even if it doesn't not sound like Hybrid Theory. I am happy as fuck 1 aspect of their old sound is there. I don't care if it's not 100% identical. Atleast it's the new combined with the old. ANd it has "progressed" not changed.

I am done for now replying back, if you guys want to go ahead and dissect, write back your opinions. Go ahead, but I know how these debates tend to be. I am too old for this crap and it's late.

Somethings to get straight:

- I love the instrumental to this track
- I do not hate Minutes To Midnight
- I do not want "Hybrid Theory" or "Meteora"
- Look at my join date.

I just want "you" the LP fan to fight for how you feel. At the end of the day keep something in your mind. As much of an LP fan you are and you love them and defend them for doing what they are doing. They are doing a job, a job you pay them for. You purchase their CDs, and you go see them in shows. You pay them to entertain you. Do not conform to something you yourself know as the fan (the paying customer) knows is not what you want when you can hear it better elsewhere. Otherwise, enjoy what they are giving you.

Good night folks .

 

Shadow, since when does a join date matter in anything? I joined a month after you. Don't see me being all high and mighty about it.












Plus you only have 166 posts. Big whoop.

 

No.

So you want Nu-metal to be...different Nu-metal?

No.

 

Experience. That's why I wrote it. I knew someone like you would write back something stupid just to get me the person that wrote it go to ">=O!!! You son of a bitch how dare u!"

Can't you see I left that on purpose? You would know that from experience after joining like me and getting into a handful of debates (probably in the official forum).

But no biggy, that was the point I wrote it. Thanks for bringing it into light.

The join date is only to show that I am too old to continue this. I already know this an endless argument that is based on opinion, many will disagree and will only get people like you (yes you, sorry to make an example out of you) to jump in and defend your band, opinions, facts, etc! Whatever. Don't take it as an offense. I am not offending you. I already said beyond my 2 cents. Now officially g'n.

 

First off let me point out the uStream chat that happened just today. Mike has said that they have been making music that they wanted or else they wouldn't have put it out to begin with. And about annihilating the fanbase, I would like to call BS on that one, it seems like the majority of the fanbase that I have talked to, seemed to be highly supportive of Linkin Park's new sound, while still enjoying the old sound that Linkin Park had put out in 2000 and 2003, so saying that Linkin Park's sound changing annihilating the fanbase doesnt exactly hold up there. And also might i point out, that various bands that "stick" to their current sound, seem to put out the exact same shit album after album (Disturbed being a great example) and after awhile, it would be nice to switch it up and do something new and completely different for once, and not be a "one trick pony".

You seem to defend yourself that you do NOT want Nu-Metal, however, you continue to say that you want LP to stick to their old sound and evolve it, and guess what, Nu-Metal was their old sound, and no matter how much you evolve it, it is STILL going to be Nu-Metal.

For you to say that we were robbed of Mike most likely means that you haven't payed much attention to the album at all. With the high energy song of Bleed It Out, the meaningful rap of Hands Held High, the softer, more in touch song In Between, and even doing backup vocals on What I've Done and The Little Things Give You Away, along with samples and instrumentals that Mike is also apart of, we still seem to get more Shinoda than other fans seem to even care to realize.