Seriously, is ATS a step forward?

Discussion in 'Linkin Park Chat' started by os neutral, Sep 19, 2010.

  1. #61
    Dean

    Dean LPA Addict LPA Addict

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    That's exactly what I was thinking about os neutral. Couldn't have put it better myself. :)
     
  2. #62
    cstebila

    cstebila an emerging paradigm

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    Contradictory action right there though ^^^
     
  3. #63
    Dean

    Dean LPA Addict LPA Addict

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    How?
     
  4. #64
    Minus

    Minus ohai LPA Addicted VIP

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    I'm an LP fan that supports ATS. I play violin, viola, cello, piano, guitar, compose music, and have over a terabyte of music varying from folk, rock, hip-hop, jazz, classical, pop, country, dubstep, glitch, trance, tribal, and music from throughout the world. I guess I haven't discovered the deeper beauty of music yet.

    Also, I find it insulting that you make the presumption that most of us are 15.
     
  5. #65
    cstebila

    cstebila an emerging paradigm

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    Eh I haven't read the whole thread, and I'm not going to, as its not going to end. Captain Troy Handsome, just pointing out that we all have ego's even myself. It easy to get lost in that. Either way, I'm out, too much pointless arguing.
     
  6. #66
    Dean

    Dean LPA Addict LPA Addict

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    Arguing with people on the internet is probably one of the last things I'd want to do to fuel my ego :p I think I'll follow your cue in any case.
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2010
  7. #67
    Rocky

    Rocky Well-Known Member

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    Did os neutral say something about the deeper beauty of music on a Linkin Park forum? I'm gonna assume that HT & M had some really deep ass shit that I didn't understand through all all those repetitive lyrics, song structures, and Pro Tools editing.
     
  8. #68
    Benjamin

    Benjamin LPA team LPA Super VIP

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    Haha when you think about it, would any of us be here if we didn't argue? That's the fun of these boards :lol:
     
  9. #69
    minuteforce

    minuteforce Danny's not here, Mrs. Torrance. LPA Team

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    The album is not about bombs. <.< It uses those ideas and those kinds of imagery as a framework for the musical and lyrical concepts, yes, but it's not a work about nuclear weapons - "A Thousand Suns", like, even the album title alone is abound with different meanings and every bit of the album is open to your interpretation; same with the band's previous works.

    The sound bytes used aren't meant to be taken literally in this context and they're not meant to be much of an indication of what the lyrics are talking about. The songs on the album aren't all written around one central subject, so you can't go judging the lyrics on how they don't fit that mold. That theme that the album has, it's really just used to give the tracks a vague sense of cohesiveness.

    Shinoda swears when he feels it's appropriate. LP have never consciously tried to be "the band that never curses", it's just another one of those labels people have forced upon them.
     
  10. #70
    Gman2887

    Gman2887 Well-Known Member

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    It's amusing you mention ego with your attitude. The problem with your stance, however, is that you've appointed yourself as the judge and jury of everyone's opinions by blatantly criticizing an unproven lack of knowledge in the musical landscape on these forums and accruing the idea that an opinion is only fair if it has some sort of criticism and/or deep thought behind it. Look around you, most of the people here generally agree that A Thousand Suns is a fantastic album. Why explain themselves, as you criticize them for not doing, when there is no reason to? Now I will agree that everyone should know why they like something, regardless of what it is. But you're baiting and fishing. This isn't something someone does who wants intelligent conversation.

    Instead you come off as a pretentious fellow wanting to be that notable member who goes against the grind with his ever so memorable words of wisdom. This isn't to say that's what you're trying to do, but you'd have a hard time fooling people otherwise at this point. This is especially true when you claim people have done a poor job of refuting you. Here's one then: What do you mean by "love confessions to Linkin Park?" I have seen fans, but I've not seen an unshakable fan. You seem to be content on asking all the questions, but when an answer is given you change the game and claim that it has not answered well enough. So, yes, this right here has very little to do with Linkin Park and is directly aimed at your terrible attitude sir. But since you're asking all the questions, I feel the need to do the same:

    Why was Minus's reply inadequate? He seemed to address everything fairly. There have been various pros and cons on most posts and even if they aren't all iron clad there are certainly enough to award as smart replies. Exactly what are you looking for? Is the album weak in areas to you because you don't find it unique as a genre? Did it occur to you that the melodic vocals, or as you refer, "radio friendly" portions of songs might be a staple that Linkin Park can flawlessly attach to differing genres including a non-commercial album? Better yet, what makes a non-commercial album to you? Is it popularity or sound? What direction do you think Linkin Park should have gone in if you're confident this wasn't the correct one?
     
  11. #71
    Dean

    Dean LPA Addict LPA Addict

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    Bingo.
     
  12. #72
    cstebila

    cstebila an emerging paradigm

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    Ok couple reasons why I'm posting this here. One this is absolutely an opinion thread and thus belongs in the sticky. The entire conversation has been opinions. Two, I have an opinion, and want to share it, and unfortunately I've watched half the day go by and not a single view on my post in the opinion thread, so I'm also sharing it here. (in essence I'm asking mods, please leave this here)

    Disclaimer: This is going to read like an opinion, not a “review.” While I’ve written many formal reviews, see here, I felt the closeness of the LPA community would allow me to share my straight up opinion, without necessarily employing great rhetorical devices in order to make a point.

    There’s far too many politics surrounding the release and reception of A Thousand Suns. We know these: the average YouTube commenter begging for the old sound, the bi-polar disagreement of critics, fan’s in online communities marginalizing dissenting opinions.

    Here’s the lowdown. For many Linkin Park fans “A Thousand Suns” is not nearly as good as many make it out to be. Experimental? Non-commercial? Quasi-conceptional, but not? Nearly everything about “A Thousand Suns” was promising to those who not only stayed with them through Minutes to Midnight, but enjoyed it. So what do we make of it now that its here?

    More cohesive? The only way in which “A Thousand Suns” can be labeled cohesive is in the fact that tracks flow from one to another. Songs themselves are schizophrenic, we go from regaee-pop-rock to synthy angst-driven screaming. Ironically Minutes to Midnight can be seen as more cohesive, as it has an undercurrent that is more subcouncious (songs like In Pieces, Valentines Day, In Between, The Little Things Give You Away flow well together).

    Outside of having a bad case of multiple personality disorder, how do the songs stand on their own? “Waiting For The End” is alright, kinda fun, but Mike’s regaee-pop vocals seem to lack autheticity, which is sad as it seems they worked hard on the whole record to do the opposite. “The Catalyst” is experimental, and is way different then anything they’ve done before, but is it really that good? After listening to just a few other artists I found much more well done experimentation (I listened to a 10 minute song that didn’t have a dull moment) “When They Come For Me” is alright and kinda fun, but as I saw someone else comment Mike’s bold-chest puffed out bravado doesn’t do much for them (and we’re never going to hear the end of ‘try to catch up motherf**** in fan communities).

    “Burning In The Sky’s” is different, and is probably one of the better songs, Chester’s voice (with or without the production) really stands out here. “The Messenger” had potential, an completely acoustic track from the once “nu-metal” Linkin Park? For many, the vocals almost ruin the song. It feels forced, as if trying to mimic others in the genre. So as Mr. Shinoda warned and repeatedly cautioned, the songs don’t necessarily work as well on their own.

    An unshakable feeling with this record, is that there isn’t much music. Following 3 years, there’s 9 “full” tracks. Here’s the thing guys, despite not throughly enjoying the record, I look forward to loving and taking apart in the community here. In no way will I go around bashing the album on random posts, as many 14 year olds do, but it has to be recognized there are throughly dissenting opinions on this record, and when asked for them, they’ll be given.

    And finally, I don’t necessarily dislike the record, if it came across that way I’ll admit my writing was a bit rushed. I just wanted to get out an opinion which was slightly more critical. I’ve always enjoyed LP from “She Couldn’t” to “Pretend To Be.” And for whatever reason, I just had to get this off my chest.

    Thanks for listening,

    Camaren

    Also more directly, its to statements like this:

    (in response to the original user's post)
    Or the countless others in threads all around the boards:

    (in response to the above quote ^^)
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2010
  13. #73
    SecondCityKids

    SecondCityKids Hey John, What's Your Name Again? LPA Super Member

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    THIS
     
  14. #74
    Gman2887

    Gman2887 Well-Known Member

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    Here's the problem though cstebila. You're quote:

    A reply:

    How is it not cohesive? Simply because it sounds different. You're not explaining well enough why that's the case. There are a lot of albums that are criticized for sounding too similar from song to song and thus are immediately bland. And how do all those last songs from Minutes to Midnight flow well? I've yet to get a strong response about that.

    [/endofreply]

    What I just did was basically reverse what the starter of this thread has done. Now obviously you stated what you did well enough and I even agree with some of your statements. This is just to show what the difference between opinions and forced/opinionated authority is. I could, apparently, pressure you for seven more pages to make your opinion clearer. As for your very narrow example of people with dull quips:

    It's a fun game posting other people's comments, but ultimately pointless since it is a message board and you're going to get a wide spectrum of intelligence and belligerence wrapped in pages and pages of interweb. Why bother?
     
  15. #75
    SuperDude526

    SuperDude526 Well-Known Member

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    True that. Even working off the assumption that a large chunk of us were only in middle school when we discovered LP, that puts a large block of LP fans in their early twenties by now. And even so, I'm willing to bet there are fans who've been following the band since the mid- to late-90s, which means there are likely large groups of fans probably in their late 20s, maybe even some who've reached 30.
     
  16. #76
    minuteforce

    minuteforce Danny's not here, Mrs. Torrance. LPA Team

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    Yeah, like, to be fifteen now, you'd have to have been, like, four or five when "Hybrid Theory" came out ... :lol:
     
  17. #77
    travz21

    travz21 Muscle Museum LPA Super Member

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    God. Why do people think ATS isn't cohesive? There are common themes in the lyrics. There is a lot of industrial and electronic sounds in their instrumentals. Each song doesn't need to mesh well with each other for it to be cohesive. Hybrid Theory has instrumentals that are totally different from each song and nobody complains about that being incohesive.

    Also, the main point of a concept album isn't to use similar sounds for each song. It's to use a common theme and relate everything together. The Downward Spiral is all over the place musically and it's one of the best albums made.
     
  18. #78
    minuteforce

    minuteforce Danny's not here, Mrs. Torrance. LPA Team

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    I think it's definitely cohesive, to the point where I only rarely listen to the songs apart from one another. :)

    Just about always listen to it all the way through (as a single MP3, in fact) 'cause it's just way better that way.
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2010
  19. #79
    Benjamin

    Benjamin LPA team LPA Super VIP

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    Cstebila:

    The problem is that the people who dislike the record have been rude about it for the most part. It's the comments such as "You guy's can't seriously like this shit" or just a dumb comment like "ZOMG RIP LP" that deserve the "door picture." You're critical post was very well written and I highly doubt anyone will give you harsh feedback because you laid out your opinion in a respectful way. Now if only the other critical reviews could be written as well as this :lol:
     

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