I agree with Zak it IS stealing from the label. But in my opinion labels are going to quickly become a thing of the past and more and more bands are going to go independant.
Exactly, and I'm not saying that it's wrong to do it, either. I have admitted several times that I think it's ridiculous what they're doing, and that I download music. I just think it's dumb when people try to say what they're doing isn't stealing. Of course we're stealing. It's just harder to imagine it as stealing, because you're not physically taking anything from, like, a store. They own that music, though, and you're not supposed to unless you pay them for it. Unfortunately, they're fucking assholes, but people are assholes in general. You're stealing, they're being greedy. Whatever. It's all fucked up. Just take the music, and stop talking about it. Gene's little rant won't do anything. Don't hate him for it.
I do disagree with the term "stealing". Stealing implies you take something so as you now have it and the owner does not. When downloaded you are now copying, not stealing...and copying material that someone else bought.
Eh, I think that's a weak argument just because you're not dealing in the physical realm when it comes to digital media, so 'copying' is just a way to get out of using that word, in my opinion.
You copy and paste, don't cut and paste. The real idea is you never leave the owner with any less than if you didn't download it.
Except there's another owner, but this time the new owner didn't have to pay for it like they should have had to.
I know, but I am just saying stealing involves one person gaining something and the other losing that same something. I'm not calling it moral or anything, just saying I don't think it's stealing.
Yeah, I see what you're saying. But since we're dealing with digital media, how would you steal that? The only way to take it is to make a copy of it, really, or take a hard drive? But generally if you're going to take an mp3 you're going to just make a copy of it for yourself. I think that if you take something you were supposed to pay for, but didn't, and you now have that in your possession which you didn't rightfully purchase, you stole that.
@Zak: Don't damn well tell me I havn't read what you said. I did read what you said and I replied. Your missing our point completely and if your too narrow minded in your own case to prove what you're saying is right then perhaps you shouldn't have posted in this thread to begin with. Don't be so fucking rude in future.
Man, I wasn't being rude, and I apologize if it came across that way. Actually, I took what you were saying as rude by talking down to me the way you did, and by saying thanks in a disrespectful way. You missed my point completely. I told you how many times that I'm on your side, and that I agreed with all of the points you said, but I was trying to explain to you that it is stealing when you take something for free that you're supposed to pay the owners for, and that would be the record labels. Again, I apologize if you took what I said rudely, but I was just being sarcastic in reply to what I saw as a disrespectful post on your part. It may have been rude of me to be sarcastic, but I was more just joking around with you, and I wasn't trying to start any sort of heated argument.
what are you trying to prove? you've admitted you downloaded gigs upon gigs of music, yet you're defending the record labels by saying it's stealing and that it's a bad thing? are you truly playing devil's advocate (if so, that's my job), and if not, then what is your point exactly? all this is doing is creating arguments for arguments sake. i'm going to go watch my pirated version of the departed now. kthxbai
Maybe he's sating that yes it technically is stealing, but feels he's justified cos of how long they've been ripping us off for? Cos that would make sense.
In that case.. +7 Downloading is easily the greatest marketing tool upcoming bands have these days. As well as old ones. Does Simmons think all these kids who are going to his concert didn't originally get into KISS by downloading? I know thats exactly the case with a mate of mine who just bought tickets for a KISS gig. Dumbass.
Look, all I see here is a misunderstanding. I apologize if my post came off as rude. I will defend to the death the idea that free downloading is not stealing though. I just don't see it that way. The best thing to do here would be to agree to disagree. Sound fair?