MTV educates today's teens on religion!

Discussion in 'Serious Chat' started by Rachel, Mar 31, 2008.

  1. #21
    Rachel

    Rachel look at my horse. LPA Super Member

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    You don't hear much about Christianity or Judaism in regards to a lot of hatred. I mean, definitely a lot of people don't understand Judaism or Christianity, but those seem to be the two most mainstream religions at least in America, and while Islam may be the number 1 religion in the world, most people associate it with terrorists. An explanation of any of these religions that might be huge despite being scoffed at would be nice. I don't even know that much about Islam, so I think it would be beneficial for people to actually understand the religions of the world.
     
  2. #22
    Iain

    Iain i am a sloth LPA Super Member

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    Agreed. Every one of them. If people took time out to explain how the religions worked, the histories, etc., I think a lot of the animosity and misconceptions would be gone, or at least diminished greatly.
     
  3. #23
    Dean

    Dean LPA Addict LPA Addict

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    I think everybody should at least try to get over their natural bloodlust and realise that, at the end of the day, we're all just animated blobs of semen and stardust.
     
  4. #24
    Rachel

    Rachel look at my horse. LPA Super Member

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    No matter what the religion, we're all on different buses, just heading to the same destination.
     
  5. #25
    Minus

    Minus ohai LPA Addicted VIP

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    “Like there’s more than one road, one path to any location
    There isn’t one single right path to our final destination”

    That's how I view it. Which is similar to how you view it. Haha, I actually had this poem posted up in Writer's Cove. But anyways, yeah.
     
  6. #26
    esaul17

    esaul17 antichrist

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    First: Catholicism is a sect of Christianity. Christianity>Islam still, even if Islam outnumbers one of it's sects.

    Second: I thought he meant "alternative to the mainstream" or something. In that case ever religion out there is an alternative religion so the definition becomes pointless.

    Third: Hitler was arguably a Catholic. But in the case of people like Stalin, they didn't do their evil deeds BECAUSE of their atheism. Stalin and Hitler and Saddam all had mustaches too, but it wasn't in the name of their mustaches that they killed all those people. They never screamed "For atheism" like one might say "For Allah" before smashing into a building.

    Fourth: The holy scriptures of these religions (The Bible and The Koran) have many spots which support violence, bigotry, and intolerance. Please see: http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/. It is not just a few select followers, it is the religion itself. Also, if you view things such as The Problem of Evil, or the Omnopotence Paradox you can see the Abrahamic God is a logical impossibility. To strongly believe in the logically impossible is insanity. The less extreme supporters of these religions only manage to seem sane and civilized because they ignore a massive chunk of their religion. They pick a few parts they agree with and ignore everything else. Hence they don't believe homosexuals should be stoned or a woman who is not a virgin on her wedding night should be allowed to be put to death.

    Fifth: I will admit I am not sure how much this particular piece of Paganism has been dressed up in new-age pseudo-intellectualism or if it is just a part of the overall newage movement. It doesn't really matter if it is old and false or new and false though. People still can't cast black magic. No, Wiccan's do not "rarely cast black magic" they never do.

    EDIT: Okay, I feel this is going offtopic. If someone wants I request they open a new thread to debate about this in, as it is definitely a debate worth having. However, it should be clearly marked so those who don't want to see it don't get dragged into it and should not take away from a decent topic in it's own right.

    Request to have this moved. If someone could put it in a thread clearly marked like "Religion Debate: The Truth, Nature, and Results of Religion *possibly offensive*" I think that would be much better.
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2008
  7. #27
    Dean

    Dean LPA Addict LPA Addict

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    Hitler rewrote the Bible to acommodate Nazi beliefs and bullied the church in Germany into a compromise where they wouldn't be able to speak out on what was happening there. He was also anti-Muslim and obviously anti-Jew.
    They all opposed religion because they didn't want outside influences interfering with their regimes. They killed many purely because of their religious beliefs. Don't talk shit. If atheism ever replaces what is actually considered religion I doubt it'll be the end of people killing other people over what they believe.

    As for the rest of your post, why shouldn't people be able to pick and choose what they believe? Those scriptures were written thousands of years ago by different people, and yes, some of it can be construed as being misinformed and inaccurate, but I don't think you can deny that they carry some truth and teach certain ethics that are a good model to live on, and if the religious aspects help them do so then so be it. I don't like fundamentalism either, but hardline atheism has the potential to be just as bad.
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2008
  8. #28
    esaul17

    esaul17 antichrist

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    But that is the point. They were just power hungry dictators that would kill anyone or anything that opposed them. They were anti religious maybe, but not because of their atheism but because of their hunger for power.


    Also, Hitler said things like:

    "My feelings as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter."

    and

    "Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord."


    He may have been BSing to get Christians to side with him, but it in the least shows how harmful religion is and makes the case of Hitler being an atheist far from clear cut.



    And I support people being able to choose what they believe. The Hoy Books all have some good and some bad things in them. People take the parts they see as good as true, and ignore the rest. But if you only believe what you already agree with, then there is no point to the book in the first place. The thing is the fundamentalists in Christianity and Islam are just the ones who REALLY believe it, who fully commit themselves to their holy books. And atheism is simply the disbelief in God. So fundamental atheism, while closed-minded, is not really going to lead to intolerance or violence (as atheism does not demand you fight those who disagree with you, unlike, say, Islam).


    EDIT: To clear something up I don't SUPPORT fundamentalist atheists or anything else. I think people should always discuss reach conclusions rationally and open them selves up to debate to see other points of view.

    Also, I by no means am saying all religion people are stupid or evil or anything like that. I'm just saying whose who aren't do so despite their religion, not because of it.
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2008
  9. #29
    Dean

    Dean LPA Addict LPA Addict

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    I'm not really a fan of religion as such either, but at points you do seem to have a narrow view of people who follow them. If I have you wrong there I apologise. I think it's fair to say that, whatever you think of the various religions, following one doesn't necessarily affect one's ability to be a good person, and for all the questionable things found within the religions there is a fair amount of good as well. At that, hopefully we can reach an amicable conclusion.
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2008
  10. #30
    esaul17

    esaul17 antichrist

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    Yeah, that is what I tried to say in my edit. There are tonnes of smart, moral, and all in all "good" people who claim to be religious. All I am saying is that they have to ignore a lot of their religion to be those smart and good people we all know and love. If they didn't, they'd end up like the "fundamentalists' we agree upon loathing.
     
  11. #31
    Rachel

    Rachel look at my horse. LPA Super Member

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    Wiccans don't cast black magic this is true, but not all Pagans are Wiccans. Wicca is just the most popular set of Pagans, and arguably, the set that wears rose-colored glasses.

    I'm personally just a Pagan, eclectic, no specific "tradition". There are Asatru (Nordic tradition, using the pantheon of Odin), Chaos, etc. Chaos magicians in particular can use dark magic at any given moment.

    Hell, I've used black magic once and only once. And I'm not Wiccan. It's just the most predominant part out there.
     
  12. #32
    Iain

    Iain i am a sloth LPA Super Member

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    Rachel, do you have any sites or books that you could reccomend to anyone wishing to convert to Paganism?
     
  13. #33
    Rachel

    Rachel look at my horse. LPA Super Member

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    Hmm.

    Well, definitely anything by Scott Cunningham. He is the author that my 10th grade Latin teacher recommended to me, and while he is good, I definitely recommend reading any book you can find EXCEPT ANYTHING BY SILVER RAVENWOLF.

    I REPEAT, NO SILVER RAVENWOLF. You can just google "anti Silver Ravenwolf" and reasons will come up.

    Uhm, a good website to get the basics and learn from various people in the Pagan community is http://www.witchvox.com

    There are weekly articles on changing subjects, plus information on holidays, get togethers, traditions, and a whole list of websites that you can buy stuff from.

    Whatever information you find you just have to take with a grain of salt. Everyone's interpretation varies, and what may work for one may not work for all. Paganism is about finding yourself and Deity, not being told what to do and conform to it. As long as you remember that, go for it.
     
  14. #34
    Dean

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    I think I recognise the name Silver Ravenwolf from somewhere.
     
  15. #35
    Iain

    Iain i am a sloth LPA Super Member

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    Thanks. I've been interested in Paganism and the like for a while, and I decided that I should research it. I'll definitely take a look at this stuff. And I will remember, NO SILVER RAVENWOLF! :lol: I think I picked up one of her books once. It was highly disturbing.
     
  16. #36
    esaul17

    esaul17 antichrist

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    Rachel: Are you telling me once before you cast an actually magical spell? Or are you just using the word "magic" to label a tradition or ritual or something, not actually a supernatural event?
     
  17. #37
    Rachel

    Rachel look at my horse. LPA Super Member

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    EDIT- this was a rambling definition i wasn't happy with.
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2008
  18. #38
    Messy Marj

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    Don't get me wrong but, to me that just seems like a strong will power, nothing more nothing less.
     
  19. #39
    Rachel

    Rachel look at my horse. LPA Super Member

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    EDIT-

    this was a rambling definition that i wasn't happy with.
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2008
  20. #40
    Messy Marj

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    It's a bit clearer now yeah, but it still seems a bit...surreal to me. My head can't really reach it, if you know what I mean? lol
     

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