U.S contractors killed, bodies defiled

Well stated! I agree with you. I think that with all of the crap that is going on in Iraq now, we should just back out. Yes, it's great that we got Saddam, but let's just face it, with all of the opposition that Americans are facing, the troops are going to have a hard time finding anything or anyone (i.e. Osama) else without the death of more troops.

 

Well said.

This is a war on terror right? Yes. The terrorists are in Iraq and places like that, so that is why we're in there. But if we aren't doing anything on this war, then we need to get the hell out of there. If we're just attacking Iraq, then that is stupid cause we're suppose to be fighting against terrorism. This is one of the hardest kinds of war because you can't negotiate with any official country leaders, these bastards are hiding. If we are doing this to prevent another attack on our country, then we should get out, cause this is a big attack on American's troops in Iraq anyway.

I don't know about the oil issue, and honestly I don't give a sh*t. If we are in there for oil, then that is just...no. If we aren't then f*ck all those politicians spreading those rumors.

I don't believe that we should just nuke parts of Iraq. That is incredibly stupid. I am so f*ckin sick of people say (in a stupid voice) "we should just destroy the whole country." Let's find our terrorists and if we can't then let's go. If we can, then find them and kill those f*ckin as*holes!

I don't really want to lean in one strong direction cause political rumors and facts are mixing to create stupid opinions (I'm a hypocrite), but if Iraq is just killing our soldiers, then we should get out, unless we have a strongly set reason to still be there in these horribly conditions our soldiers face.

 

Well if we don't do something about terrorism it won't be just be our troops that are dying...listen, it's the ARMY. That's what they signed up for, there were no hidden tricks that told them there was no danger or chance of getting killed.

 

OK, i'm a reasonable person, i can see that some of what I said could easily piss someone off, so I can understand your reaction to it Derek, but my statement still stands, also you yourself are not guiltless of throwing antagonizing remarks around, take a good look in the mirror yourself if you don't see this. I'd even say some parts of your posts are flaming that if someone else had posted might be cause for a warning.

I completely agree that there is just as much "proof" on either side of the oil statement, its just who you choose to believe, I find that there is much more proof supporting the oil/war connection, and it makes much more sense to me when looking at the whole picture. You don't see that, ok, no problem, but to call the claim bullshit is pompous and serves only to piss people like me off. In my mind, its nieve to believe that oil has nothing to do with the war when Ricard Cheney owns one of the largest oil corporations and Iraq is one of the few countries witholding oil. In short, I don't take kindly to my views being called bullshit.

"The TRUE terrorists over there (not us) however, are killing Americans because of years of bullsh*t that has been fed to them that the Americans cannot be trusted and are only there to make their lives worse when in reality it's the other way around."

Why would Iraqis believe any differently after seeing them bomb their houses, and families, intentionally or not? Wars create enemies, not friends, which is why invading a country and killing people to stop terrorism doens't make any sense. Also, the way America has treated the Middle East in the past speaks for itself, no ones done anything to help them, they have no reason to suspect that's the case now.

"civilians have been killed in almost every war that has happened on the face of the earth"

Undoubtedly and undisputably. The difference here is in the past, with the possible exception of Vietnam, the wars America has fought in were based on necessity. Launching a preemptive strike against a third world nation with no real evidence for cause newer than a decade old breaks the mold. Since when is it ok to bomb countries because we're afraid of them? That's cowardice, not patriotism. The deaths of the civilians are that much more disgusting because of the needlessness of the war.

"It's not as if we ran into Iraq and said "THERE'S A CIVILIAN!! PUMP HER FULL OF LEAD.""

No, but we might as well have. By launching this war, we put our need to "calm our fears" above the value of the lives of innocent families. We decided that the deaths of Iraqi men, women, and children, were acceptable because we were afraid. THAT, my friends, is BULLSHIT.

" but if 9/11 had never happened I guarantee you Bush would have never attempted war with anyone or put the country in a large deficit"

1) There is ample proof from eye witness acounts inside the whitehouse that Bush was looking for reasons, and planning, to attack Iraq prior to the 9/11 attacks. =

2) After 9/11, Rummesfield told Bush that since there were no great targets in Afghanistan (the source of the attacks, no link whatsoever to Iraq proved then or now) instead said that we should attack Iraq.

3) The war is not the sole cause for the deficit, Bush's tax cut plan is equally blameable. Had the tax cuts waited until our country brought in more of a surpluss, things could ahve been different. The fact that Bush had no idea what he was doing with the economy was clear when both Democrats and Republicans asked for a breakdown of his taxcut plan to see where the money was coming from and he refused.

"when 9/11 happened it hurt a lot more then just our economy"

no doubt, it gave our furrless leader cause to attack random targets, destroy foreign relations, and make a joke of the lives lost on a tragedy.

" That's what I was going to say before Shade influenced me to go on a different path.

If they aren't going to fight back, then they need to get the hell out of Iraq as quickly as possible."

I don't influence you, you make your own decisions.

I'm inclined to agree that the troops should be pulled, but even then I don't see that as a solution. What happens then is another ruthless dictator takes over because we didn't finish our job restoring the country, and then it gives the Iraqi's more cause to hate us -- we didn't fulfill our promises once again. I've said time and again I don't have the answers. I don't believe there is one, I guess that's the definition of a tragedy.

 

Okay so its not alright to kill the iraqi terrorists yet it's alright to stand around like a bunch of jackasses and allow ourselves to lose more American soldiers everday? Right.

Get off your friggin peace trees people. Our soldiers are f*cking dying and we're doing nothing about it, we're just reporting it and not fighting back. Think about how crazy you're sounding, you're making it seem like its alright for them to be killed. Stop being a modern day hippie and look at the facts, we helped that country by removing Saddam Hussein.

And don't even give me that bullsh*t about oil again, I'm getting so sick of hearing about that when there has been so much proof its not the main cause for the war that it makes me sick.

Oh and since the Bush bashers are flying in here again, what do you say about half a million jobs being gained this year alone? Oh yeah and incase you forgot we recentely gained 308,000 jobs in a single month. That's the biggest raise in 4 years, aka since Bush came into office. So yeah, one of Cash And Kerry's many arguements against Bush now lacks fruitition.

But I'm going to get out of here because this is a really sore topic with me and I'm not about to lose my cool over it. [/b][/quote]

I agree there. They should do what Spain did to their troops in Iraq, which is GET THE F*CK OUT OF THERE.

Ditto.

Short analysis:
- Dïck Cheney subsidized by Halliburton...
- ...Halliburton being one of the five companies given a reconstruction contract by the Bush admin.
- Halliburton makes PROFIT.
- Cheney gets LOADED.

If it's not about the oil, I don't what is. Of course, that's not the SOLE reason but it's what partly motivates them to go to war.

 

Where partly=99%.

 

To win the war on terror, America needs to win hearts and minds. Bombing Iraq non-stop and maiming their civilians won't help them to achieve that.

 

To win the war on terror, America needs to win hearts and minds. Bombing Iraq non-stop and maiming their civilians won't help them to achieve that. [/b][/quote]
America can do nothing about the terror, because they're the terror themselves.

I just found a way for the Americans to prove that Saddam has WOMD, though: they can show the receipts from when they sold them to him

 

LOL Phantom Duck, its so ironic....Saddam is made dictator BY the Americans, gives him funding....he does all this bad sh*t and starts to cut off their oil (=money)....

Americans then fight a war to neutralize him, then they cut off Iraq from all their trade partners and basically starved them, killing millions of innocents and children....

Then they go and try to take over Iraq. They say its in the name of 'democracy' and 'freedom'. They DON'T WANT democracy over there. They have their own way of living and I don't think Americans should be telling them how to govern their country. And WHAT IS freedom? Well, their sort of freedom isn't democracy, they have a whole different perception over there and we shouldn't be saying 'you are wrong to live this way'.

Americans did that to Native Americans and their 'savage' ways. They slaughtered and assimilated them all. Well, it turned out that they had a better way of living than the Europeans/Americans did. They were able to live off the land, without hurting the environment...look whats happening to our world now :wth:

 

You're a genius

 

My history teacher said today: "A bad government is better than no government. Saddam Hussein did many horrible horrible horrible things and I hope he burns in hell but at least he kept the country in order. Chaotic order, but at least it was order! Back on topic..."

She thinks that Iraq will be in horrible shape if our soldiers leave. Do you agree? Do you care?

 

i think that once our countries decided to 'take care' of iraq, they should definately finish their job. its their responsibility now.

but i also think that iraq should get its own government as soon as possible, so it has something similar to democracy.

 

Wow what a compliment, Thanks!

Edit: Ass kicker, read my post...bringing democracy to the middle east isn't necessary.

 

The GSG-9 is in Iraq. Watch out to those who took hostages .

Actually, sadly, I think they're only there for the german hostages, but they're one of the best anti-terrorism squads in the world.