iPhone 4 & iOS 4.0

Discussion in 'The Living Room' started by hawk, Jun 7, 2010.

  1. #21
    Todd

    Todd FLǕGGȦ∂NKđ€ČHIŒβǾLʃÊN LPA Administrator

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    I don't think any of the data Google has can be personally tied to you. All they might have is your IP address, but that's not easily traceable to a user. Need subpoenas and all that stuff to get an ISP to give you the user's information.

    FaceTalk is another thing Apple is late to the game with, just like MMS, copy/paste and 3rd party apps. Video chat has been around for ages on cell phones and never really taken off, I don't know why Apple is thinking it's so great and innovative. So iOS 4 gives you the ability to multitask and customize your background. That's really all that's new. Big fucking deal. Meanwhile, it still has a god awful notification system, it still has no customization capabilities, it still can't run Flash (which, yes, is a big deal to some), it's still a closed environment ruled over with an iron fist. But it can run Farmville, because texting and driving just wasn't dangerous enough :rolleyes:

    And in the meantime, they're completely ignoring their Mac product line. If Apple isn't going to focus on cutting edge hardware like they used to, then their computers are no longer worth the premium. I'm thinking Ubuntu on a custom build for my next computer. If you want something done right, you gotta do it yourself.
     
  2. #22
    Casual D

    Casual D I WON'T BE YOUR CASUAL D. LPA Administrator

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    I still don't think HTML5 is going to take off the way that Flash has. Flash has been the golden standard for many years. Does Apple/other developers really expect me to believe that HTML5 is going to come out of the woodwork and just kill Flash just like that?

    Come on now. Sounds ludicrous to me.
     
  3. #23
    hawk

    hawk because the internet LPA Super VIP

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    I think Google is trying to take over the world, it is going to buy every single site in the world and then it will buy us!
     
  4. #24
    Todd

    Todd FLǕGGȦ∂NKđ€ČHIŒβǾLʃÊN LPA Administrator

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    HTML5 still can't even do half of what Flash does. Especially in terms of games and animation. And Flash is the one thing that developers can count on being the same in every browser, on every OS. If we've learned anything from doing 4 versions of LPA, it's that every browser has its own bugs that screw up the page, and we spent countless hours working around them. And we completely gave up with IE6. Seriously, go load our home page in IE6. It's not pretty. But Flash is the one thing that's consistent. I don't think a page should be entirely Flash, but for more advanced things such as animations (which, in HTML5, require extensive use of CSS which is where browsers start to have their bugs and inconsistencies), you can count on it looking right all the time with Flash.

    Apple's just acting like a bunch of children with regards to Flash. Adobe wanted to make a Flash iPhone plugin, but couldn't because of Apple's closed system, called them out on it, and Apple got upset and now they're badmouthing Flash every chance they get. But Apple was fine with Adobe during the 1990s where Macs were the gold standard for running design applications such as Flash, Photoshop, Premiere, etc, and Adobe's continued support of the Mac platform for designers, even when no one else was buying Macs, basically kept Apple from going under. If Adobe went Windows-only back in the 90s when Apple was all but dead, Apple would be dead today.
     
  5. #25
    The Emptiness Machine

    The Emptiness Machine Out of the abyss. LPA Über VIP

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    Yeah. I think about it a lot. Have you heard of Tor? It's pretty awesome. It's an anonymity network that filters your data and I.P to a server where nothing is ever logged.

    Google can see a lot and a lot the info is kept for a while. The page at http://www.cracked.com/article_18540_5-reasons-you-should-be-scared-google.html lists five reasons to be cautious of Google.

    Html isn't anything new. It's been around for ages. HTML5 is just a re-imaging of it.
    even still, I think it will be the next major step for the internet and for computers in the long run.
    Think about it, any browser that supports html5, will run all the things that are created in html.
    So far, there's Chrome, Firefox, Safari.. all with the ability to run html5, and chrome and firefox are avaiable on all major operating systems. Which means, all Apps will work on any OS. That increases usability for the average user that may not find some programs working on a new OS they're trying. HTML5 will be hand in hand with flash but I'm not saying it will help apple in the long wrong. People who rely on apple will start to see that they don't need an apple product for html, they won't be chained down. They have freedom to break away. Apple is pushing HTML5 but I believe it might only hurt them in the long run.

    HTML5 and java can still do A LOT. Here's 92 (and growing) examples that are pretty f*cking rad if you ask me.

    http://www.chromeexperiments.com/ Note: most of these work on firefox 3.6.6 and chrome and safari. Don't be fooled by the Chrome in Chrome experiments. Likewise, apples new "safari" only html5 showcase can be made to work in chrome and some in firefox too. Even though they try to make you download their browser.

    One thing I hate about apple is how they want to patent everything under the sun. I mean, they are sueing for about 700 patents right now and most are directed at google. They'd patent the fucking sun if they could get away with it. :lol:

    I'm no Apple Hater btw. I'm a BS hater and what they're trying to pull is pure BS. :p

    Oh and as for gaming.. http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2010/04/05/google-ports-quake-2-to-html5/1 Quake II ported to html5. Which mean it's cross platform. Unix-Linux-WIndows-Mac-Mobile.
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2010
  6. #26
    hawk

    hawk because the internet LPA Super VIP

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    Wow, this thread has really got some techies talking! It's cool.
     
  7. #27
    wiiesel

    wiiesel Well-Known Member

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    Take a HTC Desire... it's one of the best smartphones.
     
  8. #28
    hawk

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    Depends on which is cheaper...
     
  9. #29
    Tomi

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    Derek, you're not much of a web developer, are you? HTML5 will most definitely take off. It's a W3C web standard, not some company's product that is adopted by people, like Flash is. Do you know why IE9 supports HTML5 now when IE6 was horrific with standards? That's because web developers nagged the living hell out of Microsoft to get their shit together and support standards. Standards is the keyword because they define how a browser is to render pages, so the developer can write them properly. Without standards, you wouldn't be able to browse the internet at all. There'd have to be browser-specific pages for everything, since browsers would have their own standards and blah blah. Think about coding for IE6 but for every browser. Firefox kicked off well because it supported standards when IE didn't, making lots of people happy, as developers encouraged everyone to go to Firefox. Chrome went really well because they set the bar high by supporting standards better.

    If it helps you think about it, HTML5 is just plain old HTML - there's nothing special about it besides being able to do stuff that Javascript has been able to do for years, but now it makes life easier for web developers. HTML5 is just a over-hyped phrase like "Web 2.0" was, which meant doing fancy stuff with Javascript. HTML is how the web works, HTML5 is just the next version of it. Like I said, it's a standard, not a product that a company hopes people pick up. Browsers already support HTML5 rather well, and a lot of web developers are rather excited to use it (actually, it's already in wide use).

    I don't really see Flash dying, but it's usage will go down for sure, because developers will start to use HTML5, because it can do stuff Flash can, but more efficiently. Also, a huge selling people for developers to write in HTML5 is that there's people that don't have Flash installed (therefore being unable to see their website), and also that Flash isn't really that search engine optimized (not as well as HTML, anyway) - HTML5 is supported by all browsers, Flash isn't. With the Apple devices becoming so popular, companies want their websites accessible on them, because it's the new hip thing, and when Flash isn't available, you know what's going to happen. And no, no one will be using IE6 anymore, so that year-old argument is out of the picture - even Microsoft is telling people to stop using it.

    Keep in mind that Flash is best suited for stuff like games. I really don't see people writing games in HTML - that's absolutely ridiculous. I can't even muster a ridiculous enough comparison example of how stupid that'd be. Something like using a microwave to BBQ chicken. Flash is used to make a website look fancy most of the time. HTML5 is making it possible to easily make a website fancy, and on top of that, with Javascript libraries like jQuery, expect it to be more and more common to see websites not using Flash primarily. I'm pretty sure the reason website use Flash is because of old habits.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2010
  10. #30
    hawk

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    I wish iOS4 used Flash ability.
     
  11. #31
    Tomi

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    It'd be nice, but I think it's Apple's way of changing the Internet to adopt HTML5 and use Flash for what it's more suited for - it's a bold move, and someone had to do it; Apple is in the perfect position for it. A whole website shouldn't be in Flash, in my opinion - that's just a ridiculous abuse of technology when it can be made more efficiently using HTML. Sure, HTML5 can't do every single special effect that Flash can, but that special effect you're doing is probably silly - acceptable for kids websites, but elsewhere, meh.

    But Android supports Flash ... Apple might have their hand forced eventually, who knows.
     
  12. #32
    The Emptiness Machine

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    I still think that because HTML5 is available on all browsers that it will cause Apple to lose their "edge" it's not an exclusive feature to them. So their "web apps" will work on just about anything. And I've played a few games. The only reason to make a game in html5 though is so that it'd be cross platform-device. Mac-PC-(Win-Linux-Solaris-FreeBSD-Unix-etc) Desktop/Laptop/Mobile-Tablet/etc
     
  13. #33
    hawk

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    I do like the idea though of it being there just in case though.
     
  14. #34
    Tomi

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    Apple's "edge" is the fact that you can smoothly and conveniently browse the web on a mobile device. Of course, against Android, they don't really have anything, and the mobile web isn't much of a selling point in the first place, as both platforms are the same. Android has the upper hand because it has Flash. But since Apple has so many devices out there, they have good amount of control over the mobile web, it can say "gtfo Flash!" and have an effect. If a company like RIM (Blackberry) said "gtfo Flash" we'd laugh at them, for whatever reason (lack of Apple-like fanboys). So, as long as Apple has it's fanboys, they've got a decent say in things. Now, Google on the other hand, is moving up the ranks, soon to dethrone Apple..

    Flash is cross-platform to an extent, so you can easily make a game in that. Again, I don't see why you'd make a game with HTML5, it's ridiculous. Sure, there's the canvas tag and whatnot, but I really don't think it's meant for *that*. Stuff like movies, where flash players are currently used for, should be using HTML5's <video> tag, and that covers a wide amount of Flash use already.
     
  15. #35
    hawk

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    We need an iOS4 vs Android thread. :p
     
  16. #36
    The Emptiness Machine

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    no point. Android wins. I mean iphone os has more apps yeah, but it's only a matter of time before Android catches up. Then there's the fact that you can install the android operating system on both a mac and a Pc.. and it's not nearly as restricted as the apple store.
     
  17. #37
    Tomi

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    Like I said, iOS is no where near as customizable as Android, which is where it fails hard. I really don't understand how iPhone users can live with having no useful information on the homescreen without having to open an app (the bubbles only give you a number, which doesn't mean much in most cases, unless it's how many emails you have for the Mail app, but even still you don't know which account has how many - this format has no way of telling you). Android lets you have widgets on your homescreen and all - hell I can update my Twitter status without opening the Twitter app and wasting 5 seconds for it to load, then another 2 seconds to get to the post screen.

    Then there's the notifications system. Horrific. Intrusive bubble which isn't really customizable to the developer beyond a message and an accept/deny button (afaik). And multiple notifications at once? That's a hell hole, from what I've heard. In Android, you can slide your finger from the top down and a menu will pop up giving you your recent notifications and system status and what-not - the iPhone doesn't have anything remotely similar to that, and I find it a pretty key feature.

    And the Apple App Store, not even close to open - and yet Apple rants about being open opposed to Flash.
     
  18. #38
    Todd

    Todd FLǕGGȦ∂NKđ€ČHIŒβǾLʃÊN LPA Administrator

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    Notifications on the iPhone are complete garbage. If you have one notification, and you get another one, you lose the first one. If 2 different applications get notifications at the same time, too bad. Android's system is miles ahead of the iPhone's.
     
  19. #39
    The Emptiness Machine

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    I don't get why Apple fanboys/girls flock to the system really. Now I'm not trying to be an Apple hater and can say a Mac Desktop or Laptop can be pretty darn good if you're into music or multimedia (though there's nothing you can't do on a PC) but why buy a phone, that can't do what you bought it to do in the first place? Isn't the reason why the iphone got so popular because it was the smartest smartphone? The system isn't the most advanced anymore so what reason to keep buying it? I really don't see the logic. :lol:

    I read and saw this one video of someone installing the android operating system on an iphone. It was pretty neat but I don't see the purpose of that either. Just buy a phone that already has android on it.
     
  20. #40
    Tomi

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    Amanda made me realise something in the laptop thread - people buy Apple because they're the biggest brand that's reliable, and they're damn good at convincing people that they are. They're also damn good at convincing people to buy shit by showing them a bunch of good features and pretty stuff, but never letting them see the ugly side. I mean, really, Steve Jobs can tout the shit out of notifications without even hinting at it's issues. I don't know how the hell he does it, but considering how North Americans will buy in any shit you put on their plate, it's a ludicrous operation.

    See, if Android has Steve Jobs selling it, sales would be through the roof.
     

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