Church plans Quran-burning event

[Agent O]

In protest of what it calls a religion "of the devil," a nondenominational church in Gainesville, Florida, plans to host an "International Burn a Quran Day" on the ninth anniversary of the September 11, 2001, attacks.

The Dove World Outreach Center says it is hosting the event to remember 9/11 victims and take a stand against Islam. With promotions on its website and Facebook page, it invites Christians to burn the Muslim holy book at the church from 6 p.m. to 9 p.m.

"We believe that Islam is of the devil, that it's causing billions of people to go to hell, it is a deceptive religion, it is a violent religion and that is proven many, many times," Pastor Terry Jones told CNN's Rick Sanchez earlier this week.

Jones wrote a book titled "Islam is of the Devil," and the church sells coffee mugs and shirts featuring the phrase.

Muslims and many other Christians -- including some evangelicals -- are fighting the initiative.

The church launched a YouTube channel to disseminate its messages.

"I mean ask yourself, have you ever really seen a really happy Muslim? As they're on the way to Mecca? As they gather together in the mosque on the floor? Does it look like a real religion of joy?" Jones asks in one of his YouTube posts.

"No, to me it looks like a religion of the devil."

The Islamic advocacy group Council on American-Islamic Relations called on Muslims and others to host "Share the Quran" dinners to educate the public during the monthlong fast of Ramadan beginning in August. In a news release, the group announced a campaign to give out 100,000 copies of the Quran to local, state and national leaders.

"American Muslims and other people of conscience should support positive educational efforts to prevent the spread of Islamophobia," said CAIR spokesman Ibrahim Hooper in the release.

The National Association of Evangelicals, the nation's largest umbrella evangelical group, issued a statement urging the church to cancel the event, warning it could cause worldwide tension between the two religions.

"The NAE calls on its members to cultivate relationships of trust and respect with our neighbors of other faiths. God created human beings in his image, and therefore all should be treated with dignity and respect," it said in the statement.

Dove's Facebook page, set up for the September event, has more than 1,600 fans.

"Eternal fire is the only destination the Quran can lead people to, so we want to put the Quran in it's [sic] place -- the fire!" the page says.

But another Facebook group with more than 3,100 fans says it stands "against the disrespect and intolerance that these people have for the Muslim people" and encourages people to report Dove's page to Facebook.

Targeting another group it calls "godless," the Dove center is also hosting a protest against Gainesville Mayor Craig Lowe, who is openly gay, on Monday at Gainesville's City Hall. The group previously fought -- unsuccessfully -- to derail Lowe's election campaign.

"We protest sexual perversion because the Bible protests it. ... What is acceptable to today's leadership becomes acceptable to tomorrow's society," the church says in its blog entry about the event.

Read another article on the matter (http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hKWWJdTrfALpbYfWB6fM58p6u-pwD9I3JN4O1)

-

Being a Muslim myself, I'm in utter shock and disappoint. Words can't explain how I feel right now. And what's worse is that nothing is being done to stop this.

[Shayan86]

Some people are just plain stupid, that's all that there is to it.

[Dinobot]

This is a joke, right? It has to be :/

[Kaleda519]

I'm Muslim too, and I'm fairly happy thank you very much! That is disgusting, the burning of any religious book is disgusting. I guess some people forgot that the majority of people involved in Islam, Christianity etc are normal, decent people. Why hurt so many because of the actions of a minority?

[Agent O]

What kills me is this...


At the White House, spokesman Robert Gibbs echoed the concerns raised by Petraeus. "Any type of activity like that that puts our troops in harm's way would be a concern to this administration," Gibbs told reporters.


Gen. David Petraeus took the rare step of a military leader taking a position on a domestic matter when he warned in an e-mail to The Associated Press that "images of the burning of a Quran would undoubtedly be used by extremists in Afghanistan — and around the world — to inflame public opinion and incite violence."

How about "BURNING THE HOLY BOOK OF A RELIGION IS UTTERLY WRONG AND OFFENSIVE"? It's like they don't even care.

[minuteforce]

I lost faith in the Church - like, all religious congregations - long ago, and it was because of stuff like this, albeit not as extreme.

[Rahat]

I heard about this yesterday and it pissed me off, now that I've read those quotes from Gibbs and Patraeus I'm just really at a loss for words. I'm also a Muslim, I just can't fathom how people can be so god damned ignorant. If he took the time to do a little research on Islam he might have been able to tell that all these terrorist attacks are not condoned in Islam. Its sad that our nations leaders don't even make any attempts at trying to reach some sort of understanding as to why this is wrong (I'm talking specifically about the two quoted above). Its pathetic really.

[Jeff]

*sigh* These people should be ashamed for even thinking of such a horrid day. How dare these guys even consider themselves Christian after this? This is a terrorist act that they are putting together, and makes them no better than the ones who crashed the planes into the World Trade Center.

[Todd]

Imagine there's no heaven, it's easy if you try. No hell below us, above us only sky.


John Lennon had the right idea.

[Shayan86]

Imagine there's no heaven, it's easy if you try. No hell below us, above us only sky.


John Lennon had the right idea.

Great post.

[Dean]

Morons.

[Louis]

This depressed me.

[+ / –]

Whoa, the Louis is a mod.

[Zakaria]

I thought these people ran a church?

[[TDWP] Jacob]

Morons.

Yup, that sums it up nicely

[Ryo Hazuki]

To be honest, I bet the majority of extremely religious people are miserable. Religion may prevent you from doing the things that make you happy by saying they're wrong and then cause you to fear the consequences of disobeying their "rules".

I, as an atheist am much happier than I had ever been when I was Christian. So, I know what it's like and I can compare experiences. Some people don't release that you don't have to have religion to have morals and ethics and to be a good person, and imho I find it strange to obey something because a book tells you to and to not just do it because it's the correct thing to do.

[Dean]

To be honest, I bet the majority of extremely religious people are miserable. Religion may prevent you from doing the things that make you happy by saying they're wrong and then cause you to fear the consequences of disobeying their "rules".

I, as an atheist am much happier than I had ever been when I was Christian. So, I know what it's like and I can compare experiences. Some people don't release that you don't have to have religion to have morals and ethics and to be a good person, and imho I find it strange to obey something because a book tells you to and to not just do it because it's the correct thing to do.
If you follow a religion I don't think it's always as simple as reading a book and feeling you SHOULD obey it, it can just as well be reading it and thinking "hey, that's a good idea". If you do feel obliged to do everything it says just because I don't think that's right, but there's nothing wrong with being inspired to do things by a holy book. Not that everything they say is good but you kind of have to rely on people to have enough common sense to at least realise that in the modern world, and not that you have to subscribe to everything else but apparently it makes people feel happier with themselves so whatever.

[Louis]

To be honest, I bet the majority of extremely religious people are miserable. Religion may prevent you from doing the things that make you happy by saying they're wrong and then cause you to fear the consequences of disobeying their "rules".

I, as an atheist am much happier than I had ever been when I was Christian. So, I know what it's like and I can compare experiences. Some people don't release that you don't have to have religion to have morals and ethics and to be a good person, and imho I find it strange to obey something because a book tells you to and to not just do it because it's the correct thing to do.

Eh, for some people, it's their life, so they don't really know misery from it because it's what they were raised to know, believe, understand, and abide by.

[Ryo Hazuki]

If you follow a religion I don't think it's always as simple as reading a book and feeling you SHOULD obey it, it can just as well be reading it and thinking "hey, that's a good idea". If you do feel obliged to do everything it says just because I don't think that's right, but there's nothing wrong with being inspired to do things by a holy book. Not that everything they say is good but you kind of have to rely on people to have enough common sense to at least realise that in the modern world, and not that you have to subscribe to everything else but apparently it makes people feel happier with themselves so whatever.

Well, I can respect that and I'm sorry if I had offended anyone.

Well, I'll just agree with both Dean and Louis, it is good to be inspired. Religion works for some though perfectly.


It's just that religion is not for me. At all.

[Louis]

Well, I can respect that and I'm sorry if I had offended anyone.

Well, I'll just agree with both Dean and Louis, it is good to be inspired. Religion works for some though perfectly.


It's just that religion is not for me. At all.

I know how you feel man. Sometimes it is for some people, and sometimes it's not. Just so long as we are all tolerant, accepting, and understanding. :)

[Dean]

Well, I can respect that and I'm sorry if I had offended anyone.

Well, I'll just agree with both Dean and Louis, it is good to be inspired. Religion works for some though perfectly.


It's just that religion is not for me. At all.
I don't think anyone would be offended by that, I figured I should just add that. I don't love religion but I don't think it's all black and white either, not that you were implying you think that. I used to always end up playing devils advocate in the discussions about religion on here haha.

[Agent O]

Whoa, the Louis is a mod.

Really now? In this thread? *shakes head*


Imagine there's no heaven, it's easy if you try. No hell below us, above us only sky.


John Lennon had the right idea.


To be honest, I bet the majority of extremely religious people are miserable. Religion may prevent you from doing the things that make you happy by saying they're wrong and then cause you to fear the consequences of disobeying their "rules".

I, as an atheist am much happier than I had ever been when I was Christian. So, I know what it's like and I can compare experiences. Some people don't release that you don't have to have religion to have morals and ethics and to be a good person, and imho I find it strange to obey something because a book tells you to and to not just do it because it's the correct thing to do.

I don't get how this topic just suddenly turned into a "religion VS atheism" thread. That is another discussion altogether.

-

Back on topic http://www.timeslive.co.za/world/article648985.ece/US-plans-for-koran-burning-condemned-worldwide


The White House added its voice to warnings that the move could trigger outrage around the Islamic world and endanger the lives of US soldiers.

“It puts our troops in harm’s way. And obviously any type of activity like that puts our troops in harm’s way would be a concern to this administration,” White House spokesman Robert Gibbs said Tuesday.

He was reiterating comments by top US and NATO commander in Afghanistan, General David Petraeus, who warned burning the holy book of Islam would provide propaganda for insurgents.

The Agency Coordinating Body for Afghan Relief, an umbrella group representing aid groups in Afghanistan, said civilians and its members in the war-wracked country could be killed if Jones goes ahead with his “irresponsible” plan.

The United Nations’ top envoy for Afghanistan, Staffan de Mistura, said it would harm his staff if “such an abhorrent act were to be implemented, it would only contribute to fuelling the arguments of those who are indeed against peace and reconciliation in Afghanistan”.

“It could also put in jeopardy the efforts of so many Afghans and foreigners who are trying to assist Afghanistan to find its own way to peace and stability within the framework of its own culture, traditions and indeed religion.”

Farhana Khera, executive director of Muslim Advocates, who met with Attorney General Eric Holder on Tuesday said the top US law enforcement official described as “idiotic and dangerous” the Florida church’s plan.

It pisses me the fuck off that no government body is actually doing anything to prevent this from happening. It's all talk! "Troops will be in danger, tension will increase.. blah blah blah"

Why not look at this from a moral standpoint and see that this is a heinous act and it must be stopped at any cost!

If after all the talk about establishing peace with the Muslim world, this is what we get, I really don't know what to say.

[Todd]

Whether we like it or not, they have the Constitutional right to do it. I think what they're doing is disgusting, but they're allowed to do it.

[Louis]

Whether we like it or not, they have the Constitutional right to do it. I think what they're doing is disgusting, but they're allowed to do it.

Exactly what I was about to say. As wrong and gross as it is, it's an expression that doesn't actually infringe upon the rights of those who follow the religion of Islam. It is extremely offensive and disgusting, but under the law it is technically legal. There's nothing we can do about that.

[Timothy]

"We believe that Islam is of the devil, that it's causing billions of people to go to hell, it is a deceptive religion, it is a violent religion and that is proven many, many times," Pastor Terry Jones told CNN's Rick Sanchez earlier this week.

Saoberlinwaves?

[Jeff]

Saoberlinwaves?

/thread

[Dean]

Saoberlinwaves?
Haha

[+ / –]

I didn't realize it was this thread I posted it in. I think I just dropped all thought when I saw purple Louis.

What I came in here to say ORIGINALLY was that I honestly think shit like this is going to lead up to another Holocaust. The hate for Muslims in this country is fucking disgusting and unwarranted.

[Zakaria]

I never knew running a church meant to instigate terror?

But I seriously doubt this is going to cause a huge uproar unless a LOT of other people actually join in.
If they don't want us Muslim people to react to them in a terroristic manner then they shouldn't give us a reason to.

And when I say "us" I don't mean to say that I'm an extremist. :D

[Ryo Hazuki]

Whether we like it or not, they have the Constitutional right to do it. I think what they're doing is disgusting, but they're allowed to do it.


Exactly what I was about to say. As wrong and gross as it is, it's an expression that doesn't actually infringe upon the rights of those who follow the religion of Islam. It is extremely offensive and disgusting, but under the law it is technically legal. There's nothing we can do about that.


Saoberlinwaves?

Sounds like it doesn't it?


I didn't realize it was this thread I posted it in. I think I just dropped all thought when I saw purple Louis.

What I came in here to say ORIGINALLY was that I honestly think shit like this is going to lead up to another Holocaust. The hate for Muslims in this country is fucking disgusting and unwarranted.

Minus, while I agree with you and fear that people's intolerance will become the catalyst for much physical pain and suffering if shit like this continues, I have to say that Timothy has won this thread.

[Gloomy Mushroom]

Let's burn the bible and see how the Church likes it.

[Louis]

Let's burn the bible and see how the Church likes it.

As much as I would agree with this, two wrongs don't make a right.

[Agent O]

Whether we like it or not, they have the Constitutional right to do it. I think what they're doing is disgusting, but they're allowed to do it.


Exactly what I was about to say. As wrong and gross as it is, it's an expression that doesn't actually infringe upon the rights of those who follow the religion of Islam. It is extremely offensive and disgusting, but under the law it is technically legal. There's nothing we can do about that.

Well that right there just goes to show how fucked the judiciary system is. It's fucked up to the point where we can't even do anything to stop such a heinous act, when we're fully aware of how wrong it is.

It's sad really when Louis said "there's nothing we can do about it", other than just sit back and watch a whole religion get spit on.

[Jeff]

Let's burn the bible and see how the Church likes it.

The main problem with that theory, is that its just the one sect of Christianity that is participating, and the Holy Bible is common scripture through all of them, so even though you may be teaching the nondenominational sect a thing about how wrong it is to burn the Quran (which is wrong by all means) it will offend the other sects that had nothing to do with burning the Quran in the first place, as the Evangelicals are trying to stop the nondenominational church from doing so.

[Todd]

Well that right there just goes to show how fucked the judiciary system is. It's fucked up to the point where we can't even do anything to stop such a heinous act, when we're fully aware of how wrong it is.

It's sad really when Louis said "there's nothing we can do about it", other than just sit back and watch a whole religion get spit on.

Yes, it's wrong, heinous, disgusting, and any other adjectives you can use to describe it, but that comes along with the territory of freedom of speech. They're allowed to burn Korans, the God Hates Fags assholes are allowed to protest at soldiers' funerals, and neo-Nazis are allowed to hold a rally outside of a synagogue. But at the same time, those same first amendment rights allow us to protest the war in Iraq or publish op-eds in newspapers criticizing the government's action. So legally, no, there's nothing that can be done. The US government can't just make up laws to stop this. But if anyone in America wants to burn a pile of bibles and piss on the ashes, they're free to do so. It would be childish, and it would make them no better than this group of assholes, but legally, that's OK.

[Louis]

The law is made to protect the intelligent and well-intentioned speech of the population but with that some of the hurtful and insensitive speech is protected too. It's a price we pay to have our freedom. All we can do is try to keep others informed and enlighten those around us.

[Xero21]

And of course they turn their messages of hate into profit, selling t-shirts and mugs.

As corrupt as they come.

[Theazninvasion68]

I am disappointed. To burn any religious scripture as a protest is wrong. Also wrong to advocate one is greater than the other.

Just as flag burning - burning religious scriptures are wrong, regardless what religion it is.

I just hope the people who attend that church turn away into another church that doesn't promote extremist qualities.

[+ / –]

I never knew running a church meant to instigate terror?

But I seriously doubt this is going to cause a huge uproar unless a LOT of other people actually join in.
If they don't want us Muslim people to react to them in a terroristic manner then they shouldn't give us a reason to.

And when I say "us" I don't mean to say that I'm an extremist. :D

It's not that this is going to cause people to join in. It's a sign of things to come. First it's a 'mosque' in New York being protest. Next it's burning of holy texts. What's next? people will start bombing mosques in our own cou- OH WAIT. That already happened. (http://crooksandliars.com/karoli/florida-mosque-bombed-fbi-calls-help-nation) Things like this only lead to an angry populace turning into a lynch mob. And it's only a matter of time before someone decides to take advantage of that mob mentality and things get really bad.

[_cam_]

Ignorant.

[Louis]

It's not that this is going to cause people to join in. It's a sign of things to come. First it's a 'mosque' in New York being protest. Next it's burning of holy texts. What's next? people will start bombing mosques in our own cou- OH WAIT. That already happened. (http://crooksandliars.com/karoli/florida-mosque-bombed-fbi-calls-help-nation) Things like this only lead to an angry populace turning into a lynch mob. And it's only a matter of time before someone decides to take advantage of that mob mentality and things get really bad.

It's a shame because something like that is well within possibility. :/

New CNN Poll:

Do you think a church's burning of the Quran could endanger U.S. troops?

Yes 83% 218222
No 17% 46057

That makes me sad.

[+ / –]

It's a shame because something like that is well within possibility. :/

New CNN Poll:

Do you think a church's burning of the Quran could endanger U.S. troops?

Yes 83% 218222
No 17% 46057

That makes me sad.

I honestly think it's not just that really, as horrible as those repercussions are. I can see the United States public just having unjustified hate for Muslims. I mean, shit like this is being tolerated. Tolerating is enabling, which will sooner or later garner support and lead to something disastrous.

[F-ck Casey]

َبَّنَا ٱغۡفِرۡ لِى وَلِوَٲلِدَىَّ وَلِلۡمُؤۡمِنِينَ يَوۡمَ يَقُومُ ٱلۡحِسَابُ

[Zakaria]

There are more similarities between the two religions then differences.

Obviously this isn't quite clear to them.

Oh and on a side-note I didn't realise that there were other followers of Islam on the forum. Makes me feel more comfortable. :)

[+ / –]

In other news, the Quran-burning has been cancelled.

[Zakaria]

In other news, the Quran-burning has been cancelled.

Are you being your sarcastic old self or are you speaking the truth?

[Agent O]

Yes, it's wrong, heinous, disgusting, and any other adjectives you can use to describe it, but that comes along with the territory of freedom of speech. They're allowed to burn Korans, the God Hates Fags assholes are allowed to protest at soldiers' funerals, and neo-Nazis are allowed to hold a rally outside of a synagogue. But at the same time, those same first amendment rights allow us to protest the war in Iraq or publish op-eds in newspapers criticizing the government's action. So legally, no, there's nothing that can be done. The US government can't just make up laws to stop this. But if anyone in America wants to burn a pile of bibles and piss on the ashes, they're free to do so. It would be childish, and it would make them no better than this group of assholes, but legally, that's OK.


The law is made to protect the intelligent and well-intentioned speech of the population but with that some of the hurtful and insensitive speech is protected too. It's a price we pay to have our freedom. All we can do is try to keep others informed and enlighten those around us.

I get where you guys are coming from, but honestly if this event actually gets carried out, the repercussion would be far greater than all the things Todd mentioned in his post. You don't have to look farther than the controversy surrounding the cartoon depiction of Prophet Mohammed [PBUH].

Moreover, even the US officials fully understands and pointed out the gravity of the aftermath. But still they refuse to put a stop to it. I personally refuse to believe that only laws and constitutional barriers are holding them back. A lot of things can be evaded through legal loopholes, or whatever you choose to call it in this case.

And even if that doesn't work, the sheer severity of the situation should be enough to put a stop to this.


There are more similarities between the two religions then differences.


True.

-

Edit: It has indeed been cancelled at the eleventh hour. (http://www.voanews.com/english/news/US-Church-Cancels-Quran-Burning-102571464.html)

I still won't edit what I wrote above, because the fact that the event has been cancelled proves that "laws and constitutions" can be bend, if it's for a good purpose.

[+ / –]

Are you being your sarcastic old self or are you speaking the truth?

Link (http://abcnews.go.com/US/pastor-terry-jones-calls-off-koran-burning-ground-zero-mosque/story?id=11594495)

I would NEVER be sarcastic in a thread as serious and heinous as this unless I was directly mocking others.

[Zakaria]

Link (http://abcnews.go.com/US/pastor-terry-jones-calls-off-koran-burning-ground-zero-mosque/story?id=11594495)

I would NEVER be sarcastic in a thread as serious and heinous as this unless I was directly mocking others.

Sorry for the accusation.

[Snail]

Religions are like really cool fairy tale stories used to justify and glorify the existence of a higher plane.


Take note, I'm not an atheist. I'm just not fond of the strings of religions that dangle in front of our faces in the midst of our time.


This burning of the Quran will only cultivate hatred and death. Fuckin' ironic.

[Xero21]

Unfortunately AOL News says he's now reconsidering the cancellation.

Fuck this guy. Seriously.

[Mark]

Nothing beats showing your hate for a religion quite as well as showing your own religion's capacity for hate.

[Chris(tmas)]

Bibles burn in Muslim countries. People reactions in Western countries? None.
Someone THREATENS to burn a Quran in a Western country. People reactions in Muslim countries? "Death to America", "Love live the Taliban", "This stupid pastor who wants to avenge the September 11 attacks by burning the Koran will not only cause hundreds of bloody attacks in the United States but also throughout the world," the statement said.", "Death to Christians" and alot more.

Terry Jones made a point.

[+ / –]

Bibles burn in Muslim countries. People reactions in Western countries? None.
Someone THREATENS to burn a Quran in a Western country. People reactions in Muslim countries? "Death to America", "Love live the Taliban", "This stupid pastor who wants to avenge the September 11 attacks by burning the Koran will not only cause hundreds of bloody attacks in the United States but also throughout the world," the statement said.", "Death to Christians" and alot more.

Terry Jones made a point.

Here's the difference. WE'RE SUPPOSED TO BE BETTER THAN THIS. We're supposed to be an enlightened country free of such hatred, and now we're stooping to some ridiculously low levels.

What you're failing to realize is a very simple point:

http://i.imgur.com/PT4KI.png

The reactions you're seeing is a very small percentage of the Muslim population. Terry Jones made no point except to show that he's a bigot.

[Dean]

Bibles burn in Muslim countries. People reactions in Western countries? None.
Someone THREATENS to burn a Quran in a Western country. People reactions in Muslim countries? "Death to America", "Love live the Taliban", "This stupid pastor who wants to avenge the September 11 attacks by burning the Koran will not only cause hundreds of bloody attacks in the United States but also throughout the world," the statement said.", "Death to Christians" and alot more.

Terry Jones made a point.
It is an overreaction to say the least, but at the same time he makes a rather shaky point because in doing this he isn't a hell of a lot better than those people, and as Minus has pretty much said it's up to people who should probably know better to not stoop to that level as much as anything.

[Agent O]

Bibles burn in Muslim countries. People reactions in Western countries? None.
Someone THREATENS to burn a Quran in a Western country. People reactions in Muslim countries? "Death to America", "Love live the Taliban", "This stupid pastor who wants to avenge the September 11 attacks by burning the Koran will not only cause hundreds of bloody attacks in the United States but also throughout the world," the statement said.", "Death to Christians" and alot more.

Terry Jones made a point.

As Minus pointed out, the people who are making such extreme remarks aka extremist are of a very small percentage. I don't get why people still don't realize that. Oh wait... the media keeps painting us with broad strokes of being religious extremists/terrorists. That's why. But that's another discussion for another day.

But in my mind it still doesn't change the fact that the act of burning a holy book, of ANY religion, is highly offensive.

If "the Western countries" don't care enough to react to Bible burning, then that is their decision. Being a citizen of "an enlightened country" doesn't have anything to do with it. If I were a Christian, I'd naturally take offence to Bible burning.

[Chris(tmas)]

Sorry if I offended anyone with my post by the way, I'm not a racist or anything. It might appear that my post was an attack on the Islam, while I'm aware that Christianity has God Hate Fags and all that other stuff. I was just a bit biased when I wrote my post.

[+ / –]

The way the media portrays the Muslim population would be like if the world assumed all Christians were the Westboro Baptist Church.

I never made mention of the bible-burnings in my post because I don't honestly want to get into the subject. The idea of burning religious texts tend to get me into a pissed-off rant mode. It's about 100% of the reason why I tend to stay clear of Serious Chat.

[Timothy]

Burning any book is ridiculous. It's nothing but histrionic nonsense.

[Hellions]

Burning a book is like burning a flag. I could cite a source for the quote but not only will I probably butcher it, it's also a pretty broad observation that most likely quite a few people have stated;

"People say, 'I burn your flag' as if it's meant to offend me. Well, no you didn't, that's your flag. You bought it, you burned it, you're burning your own shit."

Someone who truly holds their faith dear should be able to look past this material act and shrug it off. However there's the disturbing underlying principal that is very upsetting.

I say let them burn the books all they want, with the knowledge or ignorance that it will send certain messages. They think they're speaking against a violent, hateful religion when they may not understand or are more likely simply ignorant to the fact that it just shows how foolish, hypocritical and backwards thinking they are. Rallying to set anything aflame, be it a building, or books, is wildly violent and hateful.

Book burning has been around for centuries, is around now, and will be for centuries to come. They'll be burning Kindles and iPads and mass wiping hard drives loaded with PDF's for years. It's rather useless to try and stop or even get offended over. When it becomes a government sponsored act of oppression, by all means rebel and maintain what you stand for. But some shit kicker, Religion-blinded fools in Florida aren't worth it. Numb yourself, it's all you can do.

[+ / –]

The problem, Hellions, is that this action could have serious repercussions for our troops overseas. Imagine the Muslim extremist anger at the burning of Korans and who they'll take it out on. It's putting the brave men and women overseas in danger for a stupidly unjustified reason.

[travz21]

I feel sorry for the religious. It hasn't gotten humanity very far. When will people realize this?

[Xero21]

I feel sorry for the religious. It hasn't gotten humanity very far. When will people realize this?

I wouldn't say that. It's helped people develop a strong sense of morals and given us art.

It's when people take it too far that's the problem.

[Louis]

I feel sorry for the religious. It hasn't gotten humanity very far. When will people realize this?

That's extremely disrespectful. I understand where you're coming from, but please try and be more careful with your wording, 'cause I take offense to that as someone from a religious family.

[Harlz]

I wouldn't say that. It's helped people develop a strong sense of morals and given us art.

It's when people take it too far that's the problem.

You my friend, are intelligent.

[Jeff]

I wouldn't say that. It's helped people develop a strong sense of morals and given us art.

It's when people take it too far that's the problem.

This. :)

[Gloomy Mushroom]

Stop picking on the muslims, and grow the fuck up.

[Switchback]

Burning The Qur'an is a lawful way of disposing of one.

[Louis]

Burning The Qur'an is a lawful way of disposing of one.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure the intention isn't to be disposing of them, but more over to show religious intolerance of a religion that is taken to be radical when really it's only a very small group of people that are, and that small group cannot represent a religion that is worshipped by 30% of the world.

It's lawful, sure, but I'm pretty certain that when they want to burn the Qur'an it's not because they want to dispose of them. They want to send a message. A stupid and close-minded one at that.

[Switchback]

Yeah, I'm pretty sure the intention isn't to be disposing of them, but more over to show religious intolerance of a religion that is taken to be radical when really it's only a very small group of people that are, and that small group cannot represent a religion that is worshipped by 30% of the world.

It's lawful, sure, but I'm pretty certain that when they want to burn the Qur'an it's not because they want to dispose of them. They want to send a message. A stupid and close-minded one at that.

Sure. Above all, we're judged for intentions.
However, Muslims can take the positives that, this is a lawful way of disposing The Qur'an, money generated from the sales, and awareness raised of The Qur'an.

Although, it was cancelled, which is good. But, the event raised some awareness and attracted the right minds to come and see just why certain people wanted to burn The Qur'an, so they decided to read it.

[Louis]

Sure. Above all, we're judged for intentions.
However, Muslims can take the positives that, this is a lawful way of disposing The Qur'an, money generated from the sales, and awareness raised of The Qur'an.

Although, it was cancelled, which is good. But, the event raised some awareness and attracted the right minds to come and see just why certain people wanted to burn The Qur'an, so they decided to read it.

Well, I guess that's a positive. Sounds like a stretch, but, sure!

[Switchback]

Well, I guess that's a positive. Sounds like a stretch, but, sure!

Well, sure there were people saying "burn it", but there were also people thinking "why? Perhaps I should read it."
After the Twin Tower attacks were pinned on Muslims, there was an increase of reverts to Islam, in America.

[Louis]

Well, sure there were people saying "burn it", but there were also people thinking "why? Perhaps I should read it."
After the Twin Tower attacks were pinned on Muslims, there was an increase of reverts to Islam, in America.

Interesting. I didn't know that.

[Switchback]

Interesting. I didn't know that.

The masses will blindly follow media, but those who want to know the truth will search for it.

[morsedog]

The masses will blindly follow media, but those who want to know the truth will search for it.

That is sadly true. I think the sooner the media forgives the Muslim culture (not that they need forgiven) the sooner people will stop doing stupid things (burning a bunch of Korans). The action of burning Korans has no meaning and I hope the Muslims are smart enough to see that this event does not represent all of America(which is more than we did for them after 9/11). I think church and state need to be separate, but equally important church and the media need to break up (http://www.chacha.com/topic/break-up).

[Switchback]

That is sadly true. I think the sooner the media forgives the Muslim culture (not that they need forgiven) the sooner people will stop doing stupid things (burning a bunch of Korans). The action of burning Korans has no meaning and I hope the Muslims are smart enough to see that this event does not represent all of America(which is more than we did for them after 9/11).

Events like this are designed to incite hatred and infuriate Muslims. Then the media will get some minority of Muslims reacting rashly (which isn't always a true reaction) and then label all Muslims in the same boat.

And, it's going to get worse, for now.

[cstebila]

*sigh* These people should be ashamed for even thinking of such a horrid day. How dare these guys even consider themselves Christian after this? This is a terrorist act that they are putting together, and makes them no better than the ones who crashed the planes into the World Trade Center.

You should really re-consider your thoughts there. Think about it, killing 3000 innocent people, expressing freedom of speech.

[Jeff]

You should really re-consider your thoughts there. Think about it, killing 3000 innocent people, expressing freedom of speech.

Terrorism is terrorism no matter what form it is. The act of burning the Quran could have had a bigger death toll than 3000 if it had taken place. Many more American's could have been at risk, and it would have been at the fault of the person who started the burning in the first place.

[cstebila]

Terrorism is terrorism. The act of burning the Quran could have had a bigger death toll than 3000 if it had taken place. Many more American's could have been at risk, and it would have been at the fault of the person who started the burning in the first place.

First of all check your definition of terrorism, if burning a flag, book, or image is terrorism to you, well then you may not belong in the discussion. (not trying to be disrespectful, but thats such a far out definition its borders on extremity). Also say you don't like Christianity, you burn a Bible, it offends a local Christian, and they go out and kill 5 innocents. This would not be your fault.

A perfect example, someone drew a picture, a cartoon of the Prophet Muhammad. It sparked outrage in the Muslim world. They rioted, killed, stormed embassies. We cannot make allowances for such barbaric reactions. Freedom of speech, means the freedom to blasphemy, we aren't under sharia or any other religious law. It means the freedom to say or do something that may be offensive.

[Jeff]

First of all check your definition of terrorism, if burning a flag, book, or image is terrorism to you, well then you may not belong in the discussion. (not trying to be disrespectful, but thats such a far out definition its borders on extremity). Also say you don't like Christianity, you burn a Bible, it offends a local Christian, and they go out and kill 5 innocents. This would not be your fault.

A perfect example, someone drew a picture, a cartoon of the Prophet Muhammad. It sparked outrage in the Muslim world. They rioted, killed, stormed embassies. We cannot make allowances for such barbaric reactions. Freedom of speech, means the freedom to blasphemy, we aren't under sharia or any other religious law. It means the freedom to say or do something that may be offensive.

Either way. Knowing you are doing something that is going to cause a major uprising, that could risk lives, is something that no one should gamble with. The fact that the burning was going to happen, could have risked countless lives, just for the act, no matter how Constitutional it may be. Just because it is our Constitutional right, doesn't make it a conscious one. And if this one small but significant act could have caused lives to be lost, while knowing the consequences, the person who acted may as well have killed them himself.

[Switchback]

First of all check your definition of terrorism, if burning a flag, book, or image is terrorism to you, well then you may not belong in the discussion. (not trying to be disrespectful, but thats such a far out definition its borders on extremity). Also say you don't like Christianity, you burn a Bible, it offends a local Christian, and they go out and kill 5 innocents. This would not be your fault.

A perfect example, someone drew a picture, a cartoon of the Prophet Muhammad. It sparked outrage in the Muslim world. They rioted, killed, stormed embassies. We cannot make allowances for such barbaric reactions. Freedom of speech, means the freedom to blasphemy, we aren't under sharia or any other religious law. It means the freedom to say or do something that may be offensive.

Freedom of speech is fine, but within reason. If you're exercising freedom of speech to incite hatred and stir trouble, then you don't deserve to exercise it. We're supposed to live in harmony, but if everyone decided they wanted to claim freedom of speech to say ill, then racists and the like will rampant. We have political correctness for a reason. Sure, it can be over the top, at times, but it's better than the alternative.

In your other thread you said:
"Also, understanding its a somewhat delicate topic as it quickly turns to debates, lets keep it clean and respectful."
Why?

[cstebila]

Nvm. not gonna argue it anymore.

[Hellions]

I wouldn't say that. It's helped people develop a strong sense of morals and given us art.

It's when people take it too far that's the problem.

We should be able to develop morals without a false crutch. We shouldn't NEED religion.