View Full Version : Man Tries To Blow Up Transatlantic Plane
An incident on an airliner arriving in Detroit from the Netherlands was an attempted terrorist attack, a senior administration official told the BBC.
Sources say a man tried to blow up the jet with 278 passengers on board, but was subdued and taken into custody. No-one was seriously hurt.
The suspect said he had been acting on behalf of al-Qaeda, a police source told the Associated Press news agency.
President Barack Obama has ordered increased security for air travel.
Read the whole news story here (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/8430612.stm)
That's messed up.
I've gotta say it's a little unnerving to hear this when in 2 days I fly back over to California.
Think that's bad, hear this: I went over to Europe for two weeks in Summer 2006. While there, a terrorist attempt was foiled which involved the destruction of several planes from the UK headed to America. I already hate flying, so you can imagine how much more nerve-wracking that was for me.
The good news for you is that security will be beefed up for awhile, so if anything you're likely safer.
I know but it's so damn intimidating going through all those security checks, especially when you have ethnic skin. I'm also quite nervous when I fly so this obviously wont do that any good. But I guess over-precaution is better than under-precaution in these instances.
Either way I really hope the passengers on that plane knocked the living crap out of that prick. How dare he threaten the lives of several hundred people for his bullshit extremist causes. It makes me that much sick to my stomach that this cunt was living in London aswell.
Sarah
12-26-2009, 03:04 AM
I just saw something on the news about this (it was a quick news update on the tele), wasn't the 'explosive devices' firecrackers?
@Sarah:
The suspect later told the US authorities he had had explosive powder taped to his leg and used a syringe of chemicals to mix with the powder that was to cause explosion, the ABC television network reports.
Another US intelligence official quoted by AP said an explosive device had been used consisting of a "mix of powder and liquid".
I can't believe I'm actually saying this, but one of the good things Bush/TSA did was to tighten regulations for carry-on items to the point where it'd be very difficult to put a commercial jet in jeopardy. This guy literally had to light himself on fire.
El Muerto
12-26-2009, 11:01 AM
Wait, wait, wait, when I was flying to the US it took them a whole month to check my background and approve my visa and then on the airport they almost entirely stripped me down, they exactly know what I had on myself, they probably even knew what I was thinking. And now when a guy who's on the American black list for being in touch with terrorist organizations not only gets the American visa but manages to get some powder explosive on board. And the detonator fails? And after everything he says he's from Al Quaida? I'm not buying this..
11:54
12-26-2009, 05:03 PM
This is just some BS.
Wait, wait, wait, when I was flying to the US it took them a whole month to check my background and approve my visa and then on the airport they almost entirely stripped me down, they exactly know what I had on myself, they probably even knew what I was thinking. And now when a guy who's on the American black list for being in touch with terrorist organizations not only gets the American visa but manages to get some powder explosive on board. And the detonator fails? And after everything he says he's from Al Quaida? I'm not buying this..
Well, I believe anyone with a valid passport can board a plane bound for the US, but if you don't have a valid visa, US customs and immigration will put you on the next flight back to where you came from once you land; so chances are, he didn't have the right paperwork to enter the US because he never intended to enter the US, at least not alive.
However, airlines normally do check to see that all passengers have the proper visas to enter the country they're flying to, because if C&I sends them back, it's at the airline's expense, so airlines like to make sure that everyone on the plane will be allowed entry. So the failure here is either the US state department screwed up and should have never given this guy a visa; or, he never had a visa and Northwest Airlines screwed up. I think NWA probably screwed up by letting this guy on the flight without a valid visa. Our government may have its problems, but the state department and department of homeland security are generally pretty good and thorough.
El Muerto
12-26-2009, 06:39 PM
Well, I believe anyone with a valid passport can board a plane bound for the US, but if you don't have a valid visa, US customs and immigration will put you on the next flight back to where you came from once you land; so chances are, he didn't have the right paperwork to enter the US because he never intended to enter the US, at least not alive.
However, airlines normally do check to see that all passengers have the proper visas to enter the country they're flying to, because if C&I sends them back, it's at the airline's expense, so airlines like to make sure that everyone on the plane will be allowed entry. So the failure here is either the US state department screwed up and should have never given this guy a visa; or, he never had a visa and Northwest Airlines screwed up. I think NWA probably screwed up by letting this guy on the flight without a valid visa. Our government may have its problems, but the state department and department of homeland security are generally pretty good and thorough.
Well, you can call this a conspiracy theory, but I think this was just a Christmas fairytale for American citizens from American government to keep them in fear from Al Quaida so they can justify their military action in Middle East.
Chris(tmas)
12-26-2009, 08:17 PM
Who saved the day? WHO SAVED THE DAY?!
If it ain't Dutch, it ain't much.
Seriously, what a terrible security at KLM.
Well, you can call this a conspiracy theory, but I think this was just a Christmas fairytale for American citizens from American government to keep them in fear from Al Quaida so they can justify their military action in Middle East.
Seeing as security these days is locked up tighter than a drum, it is a little odd how this guy managed to get that shit on to two aeroplanes.
El Muerto
12-26-2009, 09:02 PM
Seeing as security these days is locked up tighter than a drum, it is a little odd how this guy managed to get that shit on to two aeroplanes.
What do you mean two planes?
What do you mean two planes?
According to NCTB, the dutch counter-terrorism agency, the man boarded a plane from Lagos in Nigeria to Amsterdam and transferred on to the plane to Detroit.
El Muerto
12-26-2009, 10:01 PM
According to NCTB, the dutch counter-terrorism agency, the man boarded a plane from Lagos in Nigeria to Amsterdam and transferred on to the plane to Detroit.
For fuck's sake, that makes this story even more ridiculous.. Either the whole story is just propaganda or they decided to risk the lives of the people on the planes to see where this guy is heading to..
According to NCTB, the dutch counter-terrorism agency, the man boarded a plane from Lagos in Nigeria to Amsterdam and transferred on to the plane to Detroit.
Well, security in Nigeria is known for being lax and the screeners can be bribed quite easily. That's why passengers coming from Nigeria and other certain parts of the world are rescreened before boarding their next flight.
And I think the US rescreens all incoming passengers from foreign countries regardless of which country they came from. After coming in from Frankfurt back in March, I was rescreened in Chicago before boarding my next flight to St. Louis. Apparently we can't trust the Germans, even though I bet airport security in Germany is 20 times better than ours :rolleyes: Then again, the Germans must not trust themselves because I was rescreened after the Berlin-Frankfurt leg of that trip.
Disturbedthoughts
12-26-2009, 10:32 PM
I don't really know what to think...It doesn't make sense, and when I was watching CNN they interviewed two people that were on the plane and they both gave completely contradictory stories on what happened. One woman said he was screaming his head off about Afghanistan and Al Quaida and was making all kinds of threats and such. The other woman said he stood up and was really quiet and didn't go out of his way to make a scene. I'm more inclined to believe the second woman. But the truth is probably in the middle somewhere. Still doesn't make sense though.
Dr. Octogonapus
12-27-2009, 06:53 AM
Title should be more like "Patsy allegedly attempts to blow up plane so Big Brother can invade our lives even more."
I find it hilarious that people believe some of the shit they see on the news. I'm not surprised in the least that the passengers' stories totally contradict each other and the guy managed to get through post-9/11 airport security TWICE, despite the fact that he's seemingly one of the last people that should ever be allowed on an airplane. Obvious propaganda at work here.
"Go back to bed America, your government has figured it all out." - Bill Hicks
The good news for you is that security will be beefed up for awhile, so if anything you're likely safer.
If waiting in line for 6 hours just so you can practically get raped before you're allowed to board an airplane is "safer," I suppose you're right.
esaul17
12-27-2009, 07:46 AM
If it was a government set up, I would think it more likely they'd get the passengers reports to line up.
Dedicated
12-27-2009, 03:07 PM
I think there's always likely to be contradictory stories at moments like these. Mainly because people are in shock and have no control over what's going on, so they panic.
If it were a government set up, I doubt they'd let an entire aeroplane in on it.
I wouldn't be at all surprised if it was propaganda, there's no doubt in my mind that 9/11 was.
Think of how tightened the stronghold of fear over everyone would be if this attack was successful - having to know that Christmas day, the most important holiday in the western world would also be a day of rememberance. I can't begin to imagine how depressing that would be.
Either way I'm gonna probably be stripped searched when I board my flight tomorrow, you know, brown skin and all.
Chris(tmas)
12-27-2009, 04:18 PM
I think there's always likely to be contradictory stories at moments like these. Mainly because people are in shock and have no control over what's going on, so they panic.
If it were a government set up, I doubt they'd let an entire aeroplane in on it.
9/11?
Just kidding, don't wanna get that discussion again :lol:
_______
The website mlive.com talked with passenger Kurt Haskell from Michigan
"Haskell said he and his wife were sitting on the ground near their boarding gate in Amsterdam, which is when they saw Mutallab approach the gate with an unidentified man (http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/index.ssf/2009/12/flight_253_passenger_says_at_l.html). (..) While Mutallab was poorly dressed, his friend was dressed in an expensive suit, Haskell said. He says the suited man asked ticket agents whether Mutallab could board without a passport. “The guy said, 'He's from Sudan and we do this all the time."
_______
Were the proper security checks performed?
Yes, say Dutch authorities, who say he passed through normal procedures and that "security was well-performed." He is known to have passed through a metal detector and his luggage was X-rayed. Extra attention is normally applied to passengers arriving from Nigeria because of concerns over fraud and smuggling. Nevertheless airports around the world have stepped up security procedures in the wake of the incident, increasing pat-downs and secondary searches.
Is there any way of detecting these kind of explosives?
A preliminary FBI analysis indicates the device contained PETN, also known as Pentaerythritol Tetranitrate, a highly explosive chemical. Experts say this would have been picked up using a swab commonly used in secondary screening. A body scan, particularly the new 3D imaging scanners being trailed at some airports, would also have spotted something strapped to his body, even in the crotch area.
http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/12/27/airline.attack.qanda/index.html
Title should be more like "Patsy allegedly attempts to blow up plane so Big Brother can invade our lives even more."
I find it hilarious that people believe some of the shit they see on the news. I'm not surprised in the least that the passengers' stories totally contradict each other and the guy managed to get through post-9/11 airport security TWICE, despite the fact that he's seemingly one of the last people that should ever be allowed on an airplane. Obvious propaganda at work here.
"Go back to bed America, your government has figured it all out." - Bill Hicks
If waiting in line for 6 hours just so you can practically get raped before you're allowed to board an airplane is "safer," I suppose you're right.
Huh? I boarded a plane in Europe bound for America a week after the suspected 2006 bombing plots. I did not wait in line for 6 hrs, and I was not given a pat down. And I'm Muslim.
There was a regular security check, and an additional one at the gate where our carry-on luggage was searched (all passengers), and another metal/chemical detector. The additional time lost was maybe 45 mins.
El Muerto
12-27-2009, 10:53 PM
Huh? I boarded a plane in Europe bound for America a week after the suspected 2006 bombing plots. I did not wait in line for 6 hrs, and I was not given a pat down. And I'm Muslim.
There was a regular security check, and an additional one at the gate where our carry-on luggage was searched (all passengers), and another metal/chemical detector. The additional time lost was maybe 45 mins.
I'm pretty sure 6 hours was intentional exaggeration, but it is a fact that the waits are long.
And there's one thing I don't get. There's so much security at airports but you can board any any bus or train (even the international ones) with a nuclear warhead in your backpack and kill as many people and cause as much material damage. Or is it all just about protecting the super expensive planes? As I sad, I don't get it..
I'm pretty sure 6 hours was intentional exaggeration, but it is a fact that the waits are long.
And there's one thing I don't get. There's so much security at airports but you can board any any bus or train (even the international ones) with a nuclear warhead in your backpack and kill as many people and cause as much material damage. Or is it all just about protecting the super expensive planes? As I sad, I don't get it..
Terrorists don't bother with buses or trains because the potential death toll from setting off a bomb on one is relatively small. Maybe about 60 on a bus and perhaps about the same amount on a train (trains are long, and people outside the car where the bomb is set off probably won't be killed). Whereas the death toll from a bomb on a plane is much higher, a relatively small explosive device can blow out a hole in the fuselage which will kill everyone on board, and if they're lucky, the plane will crash into some houses or some buildings and take out people on the ground.
Like with anything else, it's about return on investment, and I guess the terror groups don't want to waste a good suicide bomber on a bus with 60 passengers.
Chris(tmas)
12-27-2009, 11:26 PM
Terrorists don't bother with buses or trains because the potential death toll from setting off a bomb on one is relatively small. Maybe about 60 on a bus and perhaps about the same amount on a train (trains are long, and people outside the car where the bomb is set off probably won't be killed). Whereas the death toll from a bomb on a plane is much higher, a relatively small explosive device can blow out a hole in the fuselage which will kill everyone on board, and if they're lucky, the plane will crash into some houses or some buildings and take out people on the ground.
Like with anything else, it's about return on investment, and I guess the terror groups don't want to waste a good suicide bomber on a bus with 60 passengers.
If I were a terrorist, I would rather blow up a bus than a plane. Not because of the death toll but because of the scary thought that terrorists are not only in the air but very close to you.
El Muerto
12-27-2009, 11:31 PM
Todd, I wrote a huge reply to you but my fucking firefox crashed and I can't be bothered to write it all again. To cut it short, you can produce as much fear, material damage and causalities with a bus or a train or even a car in a place with a lot of people around (tourist places, markets, ultra high speed trains that run trough city areas, etc.). Not to mention that most of the attacks worldwide are done in buses and cars, actually the only plane related terrorist attack I can think of right now is 9/11, and it's highly likely it was sponsored by someone from the US government.
And I'm not advocating general tightening up of the security because that leads to even more panic and a Big Brother society. I'm just saying.. Planes are expensive, buses are cheap, and the death toll outcomes are not that much of a difference..
Dedicated
12-27-2009, 11:47 PM
If they blew up the Euro Tunnel it'd be a huge catastrophe. I think security for them needs to be increased.
Louis
12-28-2009, 12:32 AM
I'm just glad everyone's okay and that this man is being dealt with.
Derek The Infamous
12-28-2009, 01:26 AM
Is it possible for us to have a serious political talk about terrorism; or national security without someone coming into a thread, and claiming 9/11 or any other terrorist attack is a government conspiracy?
People need to take off the tinfoil hats. This wasn't Obama's doing...it was some Nigerian moron who probably was mad that he wasn't wired money for his 'legitimate business proposal'.
Louis
12-28-2009, 01:34 AM
Is it possible for us to have a serious political talk about terrorism; or national security without someone coming into a thread, and claiming 9/11 or any other terrorist attack is a government conspiracy?
People need to take off the tinfoil hats. This wasn't Obama's doing...it was some Nigerian moron who probably was mad that he wasn't wired money for his 'legitimate business proposal'.
Well, I think it's fair to say that it's okay for people to postulate their theories. I agree that it's not fair to just go and declare that the government supported or initiated a terrorist attack on its own country, but, I don't think it isn't serious to talk about potential conspiracy theories. At least, one should explain his or herself if they truly think that a conspiracy is in place.
El Muerto
12-28-2009, 10:15 AM
Is it possible for us to have a serious political talk about terrorism; or national security without someone coming into a thread, and claiming 9/11 or any other terrorist attack is a government conspiracy?
What's wrong with that? I know that many people died there and that some of you guys are still sensitive about that, but you have to acknowledge that there are pretty good that 9/11 was a conspiracy. Of course, I don't want to argue about that here and now, or go on with that discussion, there's plenty material online to see and watch so everyone can make a judgment on their own.
People need to take off the tinfoil hats. This wasn't Obama's doing...it was some Nigerian moron who probably was mad that he wasn't wired money for his 'legitimate business proposal'.
Of course it wasn't Obama, there are always people in the shadow who have more power than even the president himself. It's like that in every country. Always has been and always will.
Nikki
12-28-2009, 04:27 PM
What's wrong with that? I know that many people died there and that some of you guys are still sensitive about that, but you have to acknowledge that there are pretty good that 9/11 was a conspiracy. Of course, I don't want to argue about that here and now, or go on with that discussion, there's plenty material online to see and watch so everyone can make a judgment on their own.
Nah he's not having a go at the 9/11 conspiracies (which I admit are actually very plausible), just the fact that for some reason there's always someone who feels the need to call CONSPIRACY111!!11 whenever anything bad happens.
What's making me laugh - well perhaps that's the wrong word, but you get what I mean - is the fact that the UK is feeling the need to go "YEAH GUYS HE WAS ON OUR WATCH LIST".
Chris(tmas)
12-28-2009, 09:22 PM
Nah he's not having a go at the 9/11 conspiracies (which I admit are actually very plausible), just the fact that for some reason there's always someone who feels the need to call CONSPIRACY111!!11 whenever anything bad happens.
What's making me laugh - well perhaps that's the wrong word, but you get what I mean - is the fact that the UK is feeling the need to go "YEAH GUYS HE WAS ON OUR WATCH LIST".
Well, you gotta admit that someone without a passport, poorly dressed and with some sort of 'bomb' in a condom/plastic bag can go on a plane... kinda makes you wondering.
Nikki
12-28-2009, 11:13 PM
Oh of course, but what I'm wondering is why the information the UK had on this guy wasn't shared and also why on Earth didn't the folks pick up on the fact he had no luggage and a one-way ticket.
I don't say this is a conspiracy, not at all - just a complete and utter failure of security. It is a shame that this knee-jerk reaction to this failure is costing so much time/money for those with nothing to hide.
Are we certain he didn't have a passport or is that just hearsay? It seems very unlikely given the fact that your passport is checked many times when boarding a plane and probably would've been checked by immigration in Amsterdam.
Also, airport security in Lagos is a joke so any failures there are not surprising. It sounds like most of the failure here occured at Schiphol.
esaul17
12-29-2009, 08:13 AM
I will for one dismiss 9/11 conspiracy theories as tinfoil hat garbage, even if Derek isn't.
Why new security regulations are bullshit, and why you should not be scared to fly, courtesy of Gizmodo:
http://www.lpassociation.com/articleimages/122909-082300_500x_odds-of-airborne-terror2.jpg
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.1.7 Copyright © 2012 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.